Thank you for sharing your impressions. Especially comparisons to Sennheiser HD800 soundstage. I am curious as to what amplifiers you were using and what impact you feel that may have had on performance comparing Hifiman Susvara to Sennheiser HD800.
I currently have a JDS Atom AMP+, SMSL SU-6 DAC and a Hifiman Ananda that I’ve EQ’d to add more bass in, but I’m looking to possibly upgrade my amp and DAC chain to get some better sound quality. For ~$1.2k, what would you recommend for an amp and DAC to go with these headphones?
I might consider something like a Topping A90 for my setup given its high amount of power and several positive reviews (as well as balanced outputs), but I still don’t know what to choose for a DAC upgrade. Any suggestions?
I would stay away from Topping as they are garbage.
Under your budget I would recommend Schiit Bifrost 2 $699 and Schiit Jotunheim 2 $399. Awesome DAC and pretty good amplifier for the money.
Alternately, I would just use your current SMSL DAC and purchase the Rebel Audio Rebel Amp $660 for an even better pairing with the Hifiman Ananda. Then you could keep an eye out for a used Bifrost 2 or save up for going over budget for a new one. Or, you might find you are content with your SMSL DAC.
^ I would do this. Replace just the amp first and see what you think. If you’re still wanting, upgrade the DAC.
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I’m not any special guy here, @hottyson, I’m just weary. Please don’t take this the wrong way. I’m going to sound like a parent telling you to eat spinach.
To paraphrase The Mandalorian, “This is not the way”. If you are not fond of a product (and I know you are not), the best way to inform a new user is to say how you don’t care for a particular brand, and to then say, “as you can see from my discussion HERE” where here links to your previous substantive remarks. And I’m well aware of the thread discussion about which Toppings had problems, etc.
It’s different with music. You are free to assert any opinion of any band at any time. But with products, the best way is to point to some explanation, whether subjective, objective, or both.
I’m saying this not really for your benefit, @hottyson but also for others who may be new here. You just happened to come by when my spinach soufflé was ready.
Cheers, and keep on being a good source for the newbies.
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My setup is foobar–> voodoo evolution usb cable → Rockna Wavedream SE DAC —> DNA Stratus V4 with KR 5U4G RK rectifier tube, Psvane acme 2A3 triode power tube —> Hifiman Suvara running off the 1/4" or 6.3mm output.
Rockna Wavedream SE setting:
Local stream, DSD wide, linear filter, 0db gain
DNA Stratus I am listening at volume level 4 out of 10. Low setting, 0db gain, out of the 6.3mm output.
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I think you need more power for the Susvara. While the stratus is an amazing amp, I really enjoyed it with the hd800S, I don’t think you’re getting the full potential of the Susvara.
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Thanks pennstac. I was iron deficient as a child and have developed a love for spinach. And, spinach soufflé from pennstac promises doubly delicious enticement. You are an enjoyable online personality which I have become fond of and confident that I may learn a thing or two about online forum etiquette. Lacking tact and poise, it has become increasingly difficult for me to not include the word “garbage” when using the word “Topping” in sentences. These words have developed into synonyms in my vernacular.
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Vernacular
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Each time I recommend that people stay away from garbage or in this case, Topping garbage, your idea to link to where I have referenced saying it earlier is a splendid suggestion that would definitely aid in assisting new users. Deep down I believe that friends don’t let friends Topping garbage. Subjectively speaking of course. However, the use of failed manufacturing practices by Topping is an objective matter. I will attempt to link to where I had posted about Topping amplifiers having been manufactured in a way that they arrive malfunctioning new in the box from the factory.
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The prime example being having posted about the garbage potentiometer that is used in many of the Topping amplifiers including the Topping A90 that the poster is considering. Topping installs their volume knobs with hand pressure. The representative for Topping stated that this is why some arrive in a broken state to their customers since the potentiometer loses contact from the board as the solder points fail from the pressure of installing the knob. Also, some customers have asked why their amplifiers are broken after they change the knob. The representative stated that this is also because applying pressure pulling to remove the factory knob breaks the solder joints on the circuit board where the potentiometer has been soldered, and thereby loses contact from the board. This was covered in detail earlier in another post including a very illuminating photo regarding the poor quality of Topping as you can see from my discussion HERE: Your Favorite YouTube reviewers - #148 by hottyson
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Probably so, but I will need to listen to some of the amplifier before making the plunge. I read speaker amp, but don’t really want to re-terminate cable.
Saw the new Hifiman EF1000, but the price scares me. I think I better off buying a 2 channel setup for the price of that amp. I read the Headamp GS-X mini is decent, the Benchmark HPA4, Bakoon 13r, Enleum 23r and so forth.
To be honest, I think the Susvara should be price around $2500 not that it isn’t enjoyable. But, the leap above other headphones are not huge in term of improvement but the overall package it provides is great.
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Well I think you’ll see a larger step above the hd800S when its ran on better pairing. I love(d) the hd800S, I just felt the susvara did it all better other than stage, but the susvara stage isn’t bad on the right chain.
I would never pay 4k or more for the Susvara. You can find them well under msrp.
I would look at the Bakoon and supposedly hifiman has a new amp coming out, EF400. Jude from headfi mentioned it in the upcoming ad for canjam. The ferrum Orr + hypsos is another option that some like.
This is also all preference. But I feel when I went back to the hd800S after using the sus, it felt kinda dead. The sus has this texture, speed, ability to go low in the bass and high in the highs without being harsh. The timbre and naturalness is awesome to me.
And again, this is coming from someone who loves hd650, hd580 and the hd800S.
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Much better and funny to boot. In other times in other fora (the proper plural of forum) I might have learned to eat my spinach after rants about Radio Shack “Optimus” equipment and the imaging and bass characteristics of Bose 901 speakers.
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I agreed with you, I will be attending CanJam NYC in a few days I am sure there will be some Susvara setup there to try out.
After listen to the Susvara, then I realized how bright or treble peaky the Sennheiser HD800 is. To my ear, the Susvara sound so clean because it does not have all those peaky treble masking up some of the detail in the music (probably like an over-exposure photo that cover up some of the its natural color). The HD800 is going up for sale soon, because it also lost to the Susvara in term of comfort that really got me scratching my head.
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I’m considering getting the Susvara but I’m kinda stuck on what amp I’d need/want/can justify spending $$$$ on to get to run it also. Seems like the 23R would be pretty close to top of the heap but I like the idea of the Hsa1b a bit more as I’d have the choice to get into electrostats as well…for less money. Any experience or opinion with Hsa1b/Susvara combo?
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No, I’m sorry I haven’t used that combo. Some here or maybe on headfi in the susvara thread may have?
Im looking at some ss options that will drive the susvara as well. No purchases in the near future, but I’m leaning towards 23r (or Bakoon), ferrum Orr stack, or maybe something from violectric. We’ll see…
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Based on your described settings, when playing a 0dbfs track such as 1 Khz 0 Db by Audio Check on TIDAL what db do you measure? I’m not familiar with the Rockna but a quick look at the manual indicates it can output 6.6v max SE. Is the output maxed out when it reads 0db gain?
You just read my mind, I thought the Susvara is the real upgrade from the HD650 not the HD800. Except, it is not as mid-forward as the HD650 and the treble is better not as dark, better bass extension. Similar in laid-back presentation, comfort, vocal on both headphones are excellent.
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Yeah, I may be in the minority here but I felt the sus was a natural upgrade. If sennheiser made a totl planar you’d think it would sound like a susvara. Yeah it’s different, the 800 is different from the 650, but I feel like it’s a natural upgrade in some ways.
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Yes, lowest setting is -40dB. Actually is not 6.6v, is 6.6vpp which is Vrms = 0.3535 * Vpp, so the real Vrms is about 2.33V similar to most DAC’s SE output around 2V.
The tidal test track using my soundmeter app is around 74-75dB when the DNA Stratus volume pot at 4.
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