I have heard this from very knowledgable people that FR is all that contributes to sound quality. Soundstage, detail everything is a factor of FR. Going by this I was looking into graphs of certain headphones that stick closely to Harman curve and I found this Philips X2HR. Which is the closest I found that hugs the Harman To my beginner eyes at least. So I checked up on the reviews and it wasn’t the glowing praise I expected.
So my question is, isn’t there really more to sound quality than just FR? Or am I reading FR response wrong?
There is a lot more to sound quality than frequency response.
Let’s pretend you have an earbud, a small set of headphones, some headphones with large drivers, a pair of near field speakers, and some floor standing speakers all with identical FR from your spot in the room.
Are you able to tell their sound apart?
And that Harman target curve is based on an average of user preferences. An okay reference or starting point until you have your own preferences.
This is my first post, so I will start things off on the wrong foot by asking for recommendations!
I currently have Denon AH-D2000’s that I bought in 2008 and still LOVE. But I find myself wanting something better or more or different or something, but I am wanting and clueless where to look. There is no place remotely close to me to demo headphones so I am having a hard time even determining what I should or should not try. Maybe based on what I have been able to try you could help steer me in a direction of some other models I might like that are better than what I have heard so far.
In the last couple of months I have listened to the following headphone ranked most to least preferred. 1-6 are ones I did not hate, the rest were varying degrees of unlistenable.
AH-D7000 DENON
AH-D2000 DENON
ATH-A900X AUDIO TECHNICA
AIR POD PRO 2 APPLE
PX WIRELESS BOWERS AND WILKINS
Astro A40
ANANDA STEALTH HIFIMAN
NIGHTHAWK CARBON AUDIO QUEST
ATH-AD700X AUDIO TECHNICA
HD 599SE SENHEISER
SR125E GRADO
Like I said, I love my Denon 2000’s and thought the 7000’s were better in every regard except for punch in the low end. The vocals were sublime. Very natural sounding with wonderful texture, detail and body.
Hey, I moved this post to the general advice thread because I don’t want my thread to become a hub for purchase advice. From what I can see you like well-extended bass, warm-neutral mids, and can handle a bit of extra spice in the treble as long as its in the right place and balanced with everything else. If I had to recommend checking something out, it’d be one of a few things.
EMU Teak/Ebony
Not sure these are still around, but they’re similar to the D2000/D7000 in that its a biocellulose dynamic driver-based “semi-closed back” headphone. Teak is more neutral, Ebony is more bassy.
FiiO FT1
Similar to the above, but less expensive and potentially more comfortable. I know its less expensive but I actually prefer it to all of the Denon/Foster biocellulose closed backs except for D2000.
Sony MDR-MV1
This one’s an open back with excellent bass extension, warm-neutral mids, and a slight spice to the mid treble that keeps it exciting and vivid.
Simgot EP5
Super inexpensive closed back from China, not necessarily similar to the others but I think you may enjoy it.
Thanks do much for the input! I am sure you get a lot of people asking you questions and I really appreciate you taking the time to respond to me.
The EMU was on my radar, but they seem to be nearly impossible to get. I was also worried that they would be too similar to my Denons to the point that one of them would become redundant.
I had also considered the FiiO, but the price kind of scares me. How could something so cheap really be all that good? Most of the headphones I have been considering are in the $500-$1500 range.
I had not considered the Sony and have never heard of Simgot but I am checking them out now. If I had one complaint about my 2000’s it’s that with some signal chains and poorly recorded music, I sometimes find them to be a little bit fatiguing in the highs. That makes me worried I might find the Sony’s a bit too bright for my ears.
Other than the Sony’s you mentioned all closed back phones. I do not have any need for closed back headphones as I will be listening in my dedicated audio room in my house that is set up for my stereo and surround sound systems. But I am sure that you noticed that I have not yet heard an open back headphone that I liked. Everyone says that open back is better… is it possible that I just don’t like them or have I just had bad luck with the ones I have heard?
I’ll throw in my .02 cents here and suggest you look at the Verum 2. The price is 425.00 for just the headphone, or 500.00 for the kit, which includes a spare set of earpads, a balanced cable, and case. One would be hard pressed to find a better option at the price point.
Danny Richie at GR Research and Todd the Vinyl Junkie sells them. Danny has excellent listening skills, as his business is speaker upgrades. He gives the Verum high marks.
Hi Everyone, I need some help from people who know more about headsets than me.
I work in Nuclear Power. When working in airborne contaminated areas we have to wear PAPR contamination suits. Looks like this
It has a somewhat tight fitting seal that goes under the chin and up the side of the face in front of the ears. To communicate in these suits we currently use the Radio Active Designs UV-1G belt pack radios.
For headset we are using the RTS PH-88 with the 4 pin XLR connector.
Issues with this headset are that it’s a single ear. And doesn’t offer hearing protection. I often get complaints from workers that they can’t hear anything over the headset because of the background noise.
For hearing protection headsets we have the RTS PH-16 and the green David Clarke’s. The issue is neither of these fit underneath the PAPR hood, they are too bulky.
I’ve gone all out and purchase some Silynx Clarus XPR headsets with the in ear mic and active noise cancelation and I think they work great, especially under the PAPR hood. But the workers who have to use them hate them. Biggest complaint being that they’re in ear headsets and these headsets have to be frequently shared in hot sweaty conditions by some grimey dudes. So for sanitary reasons they won’t use the in ear headsets, also driven by costs as I cannot afford to get everyone their own headset. They prefer the over ear headset that they can wipe down between uses and pass to the next person.
So what I’m looking for is a headset solution that is over the ear, sleek/streamlined to allow it to fit under the PAPR hood and provides some amount of hearing protection. I’m invisioning some kind of hood that slides over the head with half an inch thick rubber cups that enclose the ear and contains the headset. With a noise canceling mic. Wouldn’t provide perfect hearing protection but probably better than nothing.
Companies like Comply make many and you should be able to find ones that fit. Spinfit is another brand. You could let your workers pick ones they like and give them a pair every few weeks. They should be able to put them on your in ear and not have to share.
Foam is pretty comfortable but silicone rubber tips are an alternative some might prefer. I suspect it’s not merely sanitary considerations but comfort of the in ear with a one size fits all earpiece that is an issue.
Good idea. I couldn’t tell if the nozzle size was standard or not. Hopefully it is, and @Bigjoemonger could just get a supply of various sizes and types for his workers. If they use alcohol wipes or something on the over-ear sets, they could do the same and swap the tips on the IEMs.
If not a standard size, maybe Silynx could provide something. I’m sure they want their headsets to be used and appreciated. A variety of tips would go a long way to improving the customer experience.
Has anyone else heard any of these bone conduction devices? I tried the Shokz OpenRun 2 briefly today. If it’s actually doing all that it’s doing through bone conduction, it’s remarkable.
Bone conduction drivers are pretty common in IEMs. But they’re still inside the ear canal, with the BCD touching part of the ear anatomy to do its magic. That’s different than the Shokz, which are outside of the ear and conduct from the skull bones behind the ear, correct?
I’m looking for a sanity check on an upcomming dac and amp purchase.
The goal is to get into the diminishing returns area, where a material upgrade from there would be into the thousands.
After spinning my wheels for a while it seems like the Bifrost 2 + Jot 3 would work, although I’m not particularly a Schiit fan.
I have a midrange ess dac so a material upgrade to that would be more than the Bifrost 2.
In terms of the amp I’m looking for mostly neutral but not dry, so pretty much any neutral-ish headphone would be a decent pairing. I’m leaning toward having balanced inputs since most dacs seem to be implemented that way, but I don’t care if the amp is single-ended.
If you have any thoughts on a better pair in the $1500 range I’d be interested to hear. Thanks!
That’s going to be a pretty nice combo I should think, I’ve used Bifrost 2 OG and both Jot 2 in the past and Jot 3 currently. I’m using Yggy OG/A2/Unison USB for DAC these days.
The Jotunheim 3 really sounds pretty excellent for its price, far better than Jot 2 imo. It has a natural, resolving, dynamic, and enjoyable sound which addresses the most glaring defect of the Jot 2, which is an aggressive, grainy, unpleasant treble forwardness that becomes hard to take pretty quickly. The Jotunheim 3 got a major redesign, with a different topology, very little overall negative feedback (a good thing), and much deeper Class A operation (also a good thing).
The Jotunheim 3 is pretty balanced sounding overall, with a pleasing midrange, resolving treble, and punchy, controlled bass. Soundstage is pretty good, though not at the same level as more expensive amps like various Violectrics, my DSHA-3FN, or probably most any tube amp (eg Valhalla 3).
It would help to know what headphones you have, and what genres you listen to. But absent any other info, I don’t think you’d go wrong with what you’ve proposed.
One other alternate option I keep hearing really good things about is the Cayin IDAC-8 DAC/IHA-8 headphone amp. It’s a bit more $, but supposedly sounds fantastic and is very versatile/powerful. I have a Cayin HA-3A headphone amp I’m very happy with, but it’s an OTC tube amp.
That you have the Jot 3 and also experience with other amps is really useful. It gives weight to the Jot 3 being a solid choice in the $500 range.
I have been using the HD560S due to its open, non-3-blob presentation. I’m planning to buy the Edition XV to use with the new gear, for hopefully an upgrade to details while retaining an open presentation.
I listen to classical, rock and electronica. I don’t need super bass extension or slam but natural texture for accoustic instruments is important.
The Cayin units are intersting but I think I’d put that money toward a D1 rather than upgrade of electronics.
Thanks for your reply. Good to know the units make sense for my goals.
You might consider Valhalla 3 or Asgard X too, they could also be good choices with the headphones you’re talking about, and from what I hear slightly warmer side of neutral vs Jot 3…
Hey everyone! I am new to the forum and kinda new to the headphone space as well, so I hope I am asking my questions in the right place. I am looking for a new set of headphones as my current set is getting on in its years and I fear will stop working in the coming months. I tend to use my headphones more for gaming but I have also started to listen to a lot more music during work hence the reason I was coming to a more audio focused community to see if I couldn’t find a reliable set that would allow me to enjoy both as much as possible. My current headphones are a gaming headset, the Astro A40 and have been quite reliable and durable but I wanted to find something that would be better in terms of sound quality. I have done some research but am honestly a bit overwhelmed with all the new words.
I am looking for a closed back set of headphones, that are comfortable and fairly durable (I do wear glasses so that’s a consideration for me)
I would love to try a wireless headset but am wary of battery life/longevity since I do plan to wear these all the time
My price range right now is $200 usd but am willing to go a little over if it means a large increase in value/quality
I will be using these in the office and around the house
I plan to use the headphones mainly for gaming (Multiplayer & Single player games), Communication in discord and zoom, as well as listening to music (Rock, Electronic, A little bit of indie folk music too)
You’re asking for a lot and any headphone is a set of compromises. Closed back is nice to office coworkers but can have audio reflections and echo, and can get hot on your ears. Wireless limits power and do some extent sound quality but gives freedom and often good noise reduction.
Look online for reasonable bargains and consider the used market.
That said I have found my Sennheiser Momentum 4 to make most of the right decisions in their compromises. While list is now over your range, they are frequently discounted below $300, especially now that they are a couple years old and the 630 wireless is out.
In your price range is its little brother the Accentum. It’s okay but sound quality is definitely less. Both share an excellent control app with customization to your taste and have battery life around 40 hours. Really, I was surprised at the battery life.
I wear glasses too, the app can help some if you need special tuning because of gaps from stems. I don’t have a problem.
That said they are a bit electronically gimmicky for my taste, but I use mine quite a bit for movies and streaming.
I don’t unusually blast out a recommendation without more discussion, but better choices tend to go up in price fast. Lower price gets into off brand unknowns.
Earbuds are best bang for the buck in that price range but they are earbuds or IEMs. I can’t wear them for long.
If the primary use is gaming and calls/meetings, check out the HyperX Cloud III S Wireless. A used Audeze Maxwell (gen 1) would also be a great option.
I have definitely used HyperX products before. How would you say it stands up in terms of audio quality to other headphones? I don’t care about the microphone and gaming headsets from what I have seen tend to get a bad rap in terms of audio quality for music and such, especially compared to what It seems I could get for a bit more money.
For the Maxwell I have looked at them but don’t think they fit what I want, they seem rather heavy and I have seen reviews that they tend to be uncomfortable for long hours because of it.
To my beginner eyes at least. So I checked up on the reviews and it wasn’t the glowing praise I expected.