2.1 Channel setup discussion with photos!

[Lou_Ford]

@pennstac

Is there something magic about 4 nodes? or is it better thought of as 6 nodes coupling with the mains?

The thing about 4 nodes is that they can be wired in series/parallel so that the nominal impedance is the same as a single sub, and therefore all 4 can be driven nicely with a single channel of amplification. (Sure, that should be a fairly high-power channel, but class D amps can do that nicely and without costing a mint or heating up the room.)

@pennstac

My room is about 15 x 25, with a large arch opening into the entryway, then the dining room. So the 1940’s house almost gives an L shaped main listening room. I haven’t a clue what that would do to the nodes, interference or whatever. Due to placement of a piano, TV (media cabinet) windows and radiators, I place my speakers along the long side of the wall and listen across the width of the room when doing critical listening. (and when I say along the wall, I mean out a bit and slightly angled)

So the SWARM/DEBRA stuff, seems to give info for a basic rectangle room. Comments please.

Since the idea is to place each sub at or near a low-frequency null point based on the placement of previous subs, the L shape may not change matters all that much. The main complication would be that one wall is going to wind up with 2 subs. Odds are that will be along the longest wall, or you could simply decide that you’re going to place that last sub at the lowest remaining point on that longest wall, regardless.

Also, one sub would be along the wall that is common to both parts of the L. My guess (and it really is just a guess) is that the location of the sub on that wall and the direction that sub faces will probably have a considerable impact on the system. If I were doing it, I might start by trying to figure out the best placement/orientation of that sub, and then fill in the others to best complement (smooth out) from there. Keep the subs small like you’re planning, and you can move them around to get it sorted.

[pennstac]

It will likely be some time before I try multiple subs at home. Too much to re-arrange. Just learning the concept is interesting. Have considered 1 or 2 small subs at work, depending upon how many new clients I attract in the next year or so.
I can create a subwoofer goal for people in their financial plans . . .

[Blue11]

Here’s what my current set up looks like. I’ve gone through a lot of combinations for the good part of 8 years. I’m happy with how things have evolved. I’m waiting for a Jot 2 so I can integrate the Hegel/Kef combo and switch between from the Ayre/ATD from time to time.

I still have to hang up the panels and get a proper corner trap. I’m hoping to have them done by the end of the year.

[MRHifiReviews]

Dig your setup @Blue11 !!!

[ctrlm]

My speakers are over 10 years old now. I have two small B&W subs but I don’t use them for music - just movies:

Everyone tells me I need a bigger TV but I honestly don’t care

[Blue11]

Thanks @MRHifiReviews

@ctrlm nice set up. Are you running the B&W from the Musical Fidelity? How do you like it? I’ve never owned B&W before but have been eyeing one of the 7 series standmounts.

[ctrlm]

@Blue11

Are you running the B&W from the Musical Fidelity? How do you like it? I’ve never owned B&W before but have been eyeing one of the 7 series standmounts.

Yep, I think I’ve had the MF M6 500i for 6 or 7 years now and I’ve never really considered getting something else.

As for the B&Ws - the series 2 Diamonds are beautifully made (in the UK), I don’t know if they still make them there? I gradually came to dislike the dryish British sound with that BBC dip in the higher midrange and boosted highs. I implemented Digital Room Correction years ago and have them sounding great with no urge to look at anything else until I downsize one day.

Personally, I don’t know if I’d buy B&W again but I also can’t remember the last time I auditioned a speaker.

[MRHifiReviews]

@ctrlm

My speakers are over 10 years old now. I have two small B&W subs but I don’t use them for music - just movies:

I dig it! Looks like a fun system.

[pennstac]

Maybe could use a little advice. If the best advice is “DON’T” that’s fine.

So thinking about my office setup which is pretty darn good It’s a straight 2 channel, spanning decades of technology. To re-introduce it so you know what I’m working with, I have streaming going from an iPad on my desk via BT5, AAC to an iFi Zen Blue V2. ZEN Blue V2 by iFi audio - The Ultra-Affordable Bluetooth DAC from iFi audio the output from that goes into a Schiit Lokius Schiit Audio: Audio Products Designed and Built in California and Texas and that goes into my Sansui AU-919 integrated amp, which drives a pair of EgglestonWorks Nico Evo speakers. Here is a pic of the back of the Sansui:
Sansui AU-919 Super Fidelity DD/DC Amplifier for sale.

I don’t often play loudly, it’s an office and there are businesses nearby and an apartment above. I frequently play quietly - anything from stuff with very little bass like ancient music to chamber to world to edm which of course has plenty of bass. Even some pipe organ…

The Eggleston’s have 6 inch mid/bass woofers are ported, and are rated down to 38db, so they actually produce some real bass.

As some of you know I have been toying with adding a sub, or perhaps a pair of subs. Size is critical in the office, and the room is not huge but not small. I have been thinking about the SVS 3000 Micro sub.

3000 Micro

I’d probably start by seeing what one could do. Since it is an office, I don’t much in the way of visible wires, and I’m thinking about using SVS’s SoundPath wireless adapters.

SoundPath Wireless Audio Adapter

Note that one of the advantages of the SVS system is that it comes with an EQ app, SVS Subwoofer Control Smartphone App, which provides parametric EQ for the subs.

Now my question is how should I go about connecting subs to this system? Nothing above (why I provided links) has a subwoofer out. I suppose I could get some of those RCA connectors that split 1 into 2. Or I could perhaps use some kind of external crossover like https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07KJRYHFH/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&tag=coa_us-20

But I’m still not at all clear on IF I should use a crossover. If I do, should I put it in the path between the iFi Zen Blu and the Lokius? And if so should I set it at 36 or 40 hz and still allow the Nico’s and the amp to provide bass to the extent they can? Or would it make sense to roll off at perhaps 60 hz?

Neither the Nico’s nor the amp strain at all now - as I don’t play them loudly.

Or do I not need a crossover at all because I have the EQ app?

I would put the sending unit(s) for a sub (or subs) inside the cabinet that hides the amp, zen, and Lokius. The sub would go either under my extend desk, or in an inconspicuous spot alongside. To start, of course.

As always, I appreciate any and all thoughts, suggestions, and commentary, from actual help to “Watcha talkin’ about, Willis?”.

[raindownthunda]

I ran into a similar dilemma when I bought an SVS 3000 Micro, however I solved the issue by upgrading to a new Yamaha A-S301 integrated amp that has a subwoofer output. My old receiver was due for an upgrade

With your amp, I believe you would need a speaker level to line level converter to hook up the SVS 3000 Micro, since the subwoofer doesn’t have speaker level input. This site has a good breakdown with diagrams: How To Connect A Subwoofer To A Receiver Without Subwoofer Outputs I have never tried this so hopefully someone can confirm and recommend a specific solution.

If your speakers produce good, clean bass, you may not need a crossover for your speakers. I would try it without to start. The SVS app has low-pass filter, so you can experiment with different frequencies to feel out what sounds right. The recommended starting point is 10 Hz above what your speaker can handle cleanly. I have on-wall speakers with shallow cabinets so this took a lot of experimenting to feel out what sounds best. With some experimentation I was able to get what feels like seamless blending ie no humps or drop offs near the roll off frequencies. Luckily you can fine tune the settings all day long without getting up thanks to the app. See here for SVS guidance on crossover: https://amp.svsound.com/blogs/subwoofer-setup-and-tuning/tips-for-setting-the-proper-crossover-frequency-for-a-subwoofer

I also set the parametric EQ to slightly boost the levels at the crossover frequency which sounds better with my on-wall speakers. With your larger speakers, if there’s too much bass near the crossover frequency you could experiment with dropping the levels slightly. I think this could help compensate for not having a high-pass crossover on your speakers.

One other thing I love about the SVS app is room gain correction. In my 100 year old house that has a very long living room and plaster walls, the bass was extremely boomy at the lowest frequencies. Impressive at first but sounded too much like a frat party drowning out all the nuance and texture in the music. Turning on room gain correction significantly reduced the unpleasant boominess and resulted in tight, clean bass even in the lowest frequencies. Now it sounds as if the bass is just a natural extension of the speakers, and you wouldn’t know there is a sub there until you turn it off. All these DSP features controlled by the app is a huge differentiator with SVS IMO and worth every penny. I think room gain correction is the one feature that made the difference in my wife not making me return it

Overall, I’m incredibly happy with the SVS 3000 Micro and cannot believe the performance they are able to achieve in such a small package. With the dual opposing woofers there is no detectable vibration from the cabinet which is very weird to experience with the level of bass this sub is able to produce. If you listen at lower volumes in a smaller office I would be very surprised if one 3000 Micro wasn’t enough.

[pennstac]

Thanks so much - I appreciate hearing from someone else that tried the SVS Micro 3000. I won’t need a DIRECT connection though, because I plan on using the SoundPath adapter. I’ll only be connecting directly to the wireless adapter.

I also can tap into the line out from the DAC before the Lokius, after the Lokius before I go to the amp input.

And finally there is a less than line out from the amp in a Pre-Amp out - That was designed originally for things like other processors. This is not considering the Tape Out.

One of my concerns with using a simple one to two RCA at the line out of the IFI Dac

is that the wireless adapter uses RCA stereo to mono:

and I don’t know how that would affect the OTHER leg of an two from one RCA adapter - would my imaging be compromised? (Although the photo IS showing TRS on the single ends. So that may not be an issue)

@raindownthunda

I solved the issue by upgrading to a new Yamaha A-S301 integrated amp that has a subwoofer output. My old receiver was due for an upgrade

And unlike your old amp, the AU-919 underwent a board level resto, and is not due for an upgrade. Preamp is class A, and the amp AB. 100 watts RMS tested with very low THD .004% on the analyzer.

[raindownthunda]

Makes sense on why you want to make that amp work - I bet it sounds awesome!

Sub-bass is pretty non-directional, I think you should be fine with the stereo signal being summed to mono. If you had dual subs then maybe it would be advisable to try dual stereo. Although from what I’ve read, most people with dual subs run them as a dual mono setup with no issues. Since you have the Loki I wonder if it would be better to have the sub input before or after EQ? (edit) On second thought given the EQ capabilities (with custom presets) on the SVS app, I would think you would want to tap before the Lokius as it might get wonky if you’re setting other DSP controls like room-gain correction.

[pennstac]

I got an answer from SVS - both the subs and the SoundPath operate in stereo mode, so I have no concern. The subs internally sum the stereo to mono if one sub is used. Each sub has a low pass filter that is separate from the 3 band parametric EQ from the app. The low pass filter can be activated and tuned in 1hz increments.

So that means I won’t need any crossover.
and @Lou_Ford, I suggested that their engineers consider working on an app extension that would support multi-node (more than 2 nodes) and aimed them at SWARM/DEBRA.

With their setup in place, they ought to be able to work it out in software.

[Audiophool]

Nice to see other SVS owners. I’ve had my SVS sub since 2005…

I”d guess their newer subs are probably better performing but I love my big-ass cylinder in my 5.1.2 theater setup. Have all SVS now except my rear surrounds (Jbl). Which I will eventually switch to Ultra Surrounds.

[SebastienChiu]

I plan on getting an SVS Micro 3000 as well sometime this year. Just not sure how my apartment will be set up yet as I’ll be building it over the next two-three months.

[innox]

gotta love that toolbox in the living room.

[pennstac]

Just ordered my Micro 3000 and wireless connector. Will see what one does in my use case. Forgoing the discount for two at once but I’ll bet if I decide to go for a second inside of a short time I could sweet talk them into allowing the discount.

[MRHifiReviews]

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SAE 2HPD Amplifier and SAE Mark One Preamplifier; Power, Purity, and Prestige in HiFi Stereo Audio!

[SebastienChiu]

Let me know what you think of it! I decided to go wired for now.

[SebastienChiu]

Ah, my luck. My Aegir is going back to Schiit!

Thank goodness they’re local, I can drive things for RMA now!

I have a very odd issue where one of my RCA ports isn’t accepting a connection. It sits on the outside, and no matter what I do, I can’t seem to get it to hold. It looks like the rubber gliders on that side heated up and are now building up gunk in the back.

Knowing Schiit, they’ll have it sorted and back to me within a few days.

It’s been a wonderful amp - going to be getting a second one soon!