Sorry to hear your experience using the Elex has been poor. That is rather unfortunate. I do agree Clear is the safer all rounder headphone being dramatically less picky with amps on top of having the obvious advantage of higher technical prowess. It has a smooth consistency to it showing off the punchy dynamics Focal are known for while avoiding bloat. I honestly expected to have an immediate urge to sell my Elex after getting the bigger brother in the line up. However, that did not end up being the case from a specific redeeming factor: the amp. Elex has much leaner bass, a more forward mid range crammed down your throat, and a top end easily coming off as a bit harsh through the wrong sources. That changed somewhat going to the Lyr 3, but the Echo put the Elex in a realm of its own only to be further helped by the Bifrost 2. Now I understand getting a $600 amp is a ridiculous condition for making them sound so nice, but it’s one of the most enjoyable music experiences I’ve had to date. It’s my favorite combo out of all the headphones I own. Not going to list them so just click my profile icon if you really want to know. All harshness went away, mid range became super charged with euphony, and overall it gave me the best vocals I’ve heard in music. Not saying one headphone was better than the other as it always comes down to personal preferences, but the whole thing ended up being an angelic sounding synergy right for me. And I’d do it all over again given the option. Both headphones sound awesome through the current daily driver setup. The euphony just happened to come through the Elex without issue. Same on Clears although as I said, it’s a totally different beast. Not sure how to describe that happy feeling lacing every song regardless of the mastering. Found the following useful…
“Imagine playing a C note on a piano The 2nd order harmonic is an overtone caused by a “ripple” effect at double the frequency of the fundamental tone (the C note). So the overtone sounds in euphony with the music, because it’s the same tone.” - Jsim
Anyway, I still think Clears are a safer pick if you don’t want to worry about specific pairings for a rocking, musical time. More bass impact too.
I don’t usually check out the used stuff for sale over here because it is… erm… pathetic.
However, for some reason I just checked out what was for sale and realised that I missed out on a 2 month old Focal Clear for 700€ yesterday and a Clear Pro for 700€ the day before.
I thought maybe since they where a hit Focal started manufacturing them but maybe thats how it started. I very curious with how Drop does things. they put out so many great headphones. stuff that has become reference. They seem to find stuff and modify it so something that had potential but flawed they take and make the changes it needed and put it out and BAM! its the next big thing. And a lot of times it seems like their buying up old stock or something. I would love to get an inside look at the company and how they do things.
I’ve been looking at the reviews of the Echo (Feliks Audio Echo), and understand Focal uses Feliks amps for their demos. However, the Echo is rated for 100 ohm headphones while the Elex is 80 ohms. To what extent does this reflect a transformation of the Elex? To what extent would the Echo work with the Clear (55 ohms)?
The idea here is there are two types (well more but for this discussion)…of tube amps those the ore OTL and those that are non-otl…the OTL = Output transformer less…most OTL tube amps, like the BH Crack and the Echo are designed to work with higher impedance loads…100+ ohms, the Crack recommends 120 ohms or higher. To really get lower impedance headphones to work well you need to use transformers and this a higher cost…
Now lowere impedance headphones will play and work but they will not work as well as the design intended…thats why Feliks states 100 - 600 ohms…there is a very good reason they do this…
If you do try and I have as well as many of us…the bass gets flabby and less controlled or defined…
Again YMMV…but remember nothing is free here and the laws of physics cant be denied!!
The Clears are really effieicent and will play on the Echo but it would not be a choice i would make I would move to a feliks that is one that has output transformers to aid in output matching for all impedances…
Yes, I understand OTL vs. non-OTL. I am trying to figure out the user impressions and Focal’s recommendations. I myself have been using the cheap Loxjie P20 (following a 3-mica tube swap and PS upgrade) with reasonable success for Focal’s products, despite its 47 ohm impedance.
With back-to-back testing vs. solid state amps, I’m not hearing much flab from the P20 with either the Clear or Elex. In looking at the bass/sub-bass region, they just might not have enough material present for the flab to appear…?
The 100-600 ohm optimal impedance is a generous estimate. It works with all sorts of headphones from moderately low around the Clear to of course your high Z stuff. Even most planars including all the Audeze models except the LCD-4 and other ridiculously power hungry cans will have issues. I’m not going to pretend to know what I’m talking about but the Echo has a toroidal transformer and I think that helps. The 350mw of power spec probably confuses a fair number of people too. It definitely does me. Here are some respinses from reaching out to support teams when I asked if Clears or planars would have problems.
Back to your question. I originally bought the Echo for ZMFs as they’re high impedance dynamics. Just asked who makes my favorite headphones and what amp does he recommended under $1000? Fast forward later here it is. It was only later in Kevin’s YouTube review from Upscale Audio did I find out about the Focal synergy thing.
The Clears got a little thicker, fuller, and punchier in tonality. Bass kick did increase a bit but not to the point I’d consider it bloated. What little metallic edge there was vanished, not that I consider it to be noticeable on this headphone.
Elex got a heck of a lot smoother. It just became heavenly euphonic. Subtle bass lift, well seated vocals, and the most pleasing upper mids I’ve ever heard. The euphony was incredible. Like a shallow river turning into a waterfall. It’s really hard to describe.
This is all coming from the perspective someone who went from Asgard 3 to Lyr 3 and now this which is some of the most dynamic I’ve heard music. Pretty much no headphone I’ve tried sounds any less controlled or flabby. Quite the opposite.
It has been good for me. I’m not going to say it’s the best in its price range, but I like it a lot. Maybe you would. Maybe not.
That’s the power transformer. It steps down/up the 110/230v electricity from your wall to higher/lower voltages used to power the tube heaters and other bits. I think has nothing to do with output impedance, but I’m no EE.
The tubes used determine output impedance in an OTL amp. That’s my understanding anyway.
Google damping factor to find out more about why it’s generally considered important. I think it is a commonly held belief that the output impedance of the amp should be less than 1/8th the impedance of the headphone. Feliks doesn’t publish the OI of their amps, so its difficult to say exactly how bad the damping factor will be with the Focals.
Totally agree with all the comments and yes most any headphone will work and its up to you to decide how well it works…and if you like it thats just great!!
Even Schiit with Vahalla 2 states its optimal for higher impedance loads but it was redesigned to work “better” than the original V1 design and to try out those 50 ohm cans you might be pleasantly surprised.
I do not believe the torroidial power transformer in the Echo is the reason for any of this, torroids are used in closed in packaged designs…to reduce the AC emmisons to other parts of nearby circuitry that doesn not like AC transformer hum mising into these circuits…But it is a more costly xfmr for sure.
Agree here as well…even f its not electrical optimal, the sound that is might be exactly what your looking for…again its up to you to try and decide…
hello, so i have a logitech g433 headset that has a splitter (came with the headphones) so i can have a mic and headphone output. I need to connect it to my lenovo c330 chromebook since my pc doest have a webcam. it only has one headphone jack so i took a headphone jack to usb converter that came with the headphones to try and connect it to my chromebook with the mic cable in the chromebook. my headphones worked but not the mic. the mic and the headphones worked on my pc. Also, the mic didnt work at all on the chromebook do you know a cable that would solve this problem. is it a problem with my chromebook? thanks. feel free to ask me to clarify. Thanks!
Kind of hard to follow how you’re connected but sounds like you plugged the PC cable directly into the Chromebook? Can you post a picture of your setup? Plugging headset → PC cable (not the mic’d cable that is for plugging into phones/mobile devices) → USB DAC → Chromebook should work. And if issues, you can check the sound settings on Chromebook to see if your headset is assigned use of both audio and mic.
Torroidals are used in power supplies for reduced noise and radiation from the transformer. Also the way a EI xfmr is made with Iron core, laminations they tend to vibrate, make nosies etc…and its quite a process to keep this to a minimum…the ole AC hum noises…the laminations are glued together etc…to help reduce the noise…so Torroids in the way they are constructed get around this mechanical issue altogether and they way they are constructed the radiation of potential AC is vastly reduced…making it a potentially better choice in a small audio amp or enclosure…They cost more. And yes some say they even sound better…which is and will always be debatable.
I just want to take a moment and thank you for taking the time to give me some guidance and share your experience! It was most helpful. I purchased the Clear Professionals, they should be here on Monday and I am sooo excited. I do like the color way of the Professional but the biggest reason I chose them was that they came with an extra set of pads that I can use on my Elears. Two days later I picked up a pair of Elegias on that great sale from Adorama. I’m really going hard down the Focal road…
Congratulations on your purchases! I’m glad I was able to be of help, and thank you for the kind words. I hope you like both your new headphones. I was smitten with the Elegia when I heard them at CanJam in February and if I needed a closed-back pair of headphones, I’d have snagged them on that great Adorama deal. Nicely done!
I hope you fall in love with your new Clear and that they’re everything you hoped for, and more. Do please post impressions! I’d be keen to see what you think of them.
