General purchase advice: Ask your questions/for advice here!

Purchase Advice
2624

I think there’s a real danger here in having too many variables to account for - simultaneously choosing headphones, a DAC, an amp, determining if the whole thing needs to be balanced - and these variables making the decision overly complicated. It also increases the risk of you not getting the right setup for your preferences and budget. And making all this even more difficult is the fact that you have a limited window in which to make a decision and buy stuff, before you’ve even heard any of it, in order for your friends can bring it back to the UK for you. A lot could go wrong here.

There’s also the important issue of overall synergy in your setup. An amp that might sound great with one set of headphones may not with others.

I’d recommend that you consider breaking this decision down into discrete steps: making a decision about which headphones to get first, and then choosing the amp and finally the DAC. I realize, though, that you’ve got a limited opportunity and time to make a decision so I hope the following couple of suggestions help.

1. Auditioning Headphones
To identify which headphones you want to get I’d strongly encourage you to audition the headphones first. I’ve encountered headphones that I thought I’d love - from the reviews and online impressions I read - and that, when I heard them, I didn’t like at all. $700-1200 is a lot for a blind purchase. And if you don’t know what the headphones sound like, you can’t make an informed decision about which DAC or amp to buy to pair with them. A warmer-sounding pair of headphones might become overly warm with an Asgard 3, for instance.

Since you live in London, you have a bunch of opportunities to audition headphones at shops like Audio Sanctuary, Spiritland, and some of the Richer Sounds branches (the one in London Bridge might be a good one?).

If any of the headphones you can audition is really appealing to you, you can rule out headphones like the Elex that you can’t audition before purchasing. Then again, if you don’t like any of the ones you audition in London, you could take a risk on buying the Elex or OG Clear (I assume the OG Clear is hard to find for audition in the UK now).

2. Buy and Sell Gear (for as minimal a loss as possible)
An alternative approach might be for you to pick up second-hand Elex or OG Clears, that you can’t audition in a shop, and then sell them again for minimal loss if they’re don’t tickle your fancy.

Can you run over budget temporarily and then sell off what you don’t want? I ask because, if you can bring back a bunch of Schiit and Drop items to the UK from the US, you might be able to re-sell them in the UK without losing too much money - I’m assuming here that the scarcity of Schiit gear and the OG Clear as well as the Elex in the UK would make for decent re-sale prices. If I’m right about this (and I don’t know that I am, so it would be best to look into this beforehand), you could have a lot of fun experimenting temporarily with a bunch of gear and then sell off what you don’t like.

3. Calculate an Overall Budget
You’ve mentioned $700-1200 as your budget for the headphones. Does that include the funds from the sale of your current stuff? It would be helpful for you to make a firm decision about overall budget so that we can offer advice about appropriate DAC and amp pairings (again, because of too many variables).

I’d recommend putting as much of your money into the headphones first. Some of them, like the OG Clear, don’t have finicky amplification needs, and while they scale with better gear, you could get an affordable amp now and upgrade later. A better headphone might also serve you well for many years. Personally, I’d go with a $1000 headphone and $200 invested in a DAC and amp, and then I’d upgrade the DAC and amp later. Do you want to make a one-and-done purchase, though?

Alright, this is getting too long. Two last thoughts: I love Schiit Audio’s gear (I have the Fulla 2, Magni 3, and Bifrost 2, and I’m saving up for the Jot 2). But given the production delays, and given that you might have a hard time with any warranty issues that might come up, is it worth buying Schiit gear?

Finally, and I think this gets us to the heart of your dilemma: is it better to spend, say, $600 on an Elex with $600 invested in a DAC and an amp, or $1000 on a pair of headphones like the OG Clear, and $200 in a DAC and amp?

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2625

I own the Schiit Asgard 3 $200 and the Schiit Modi 3+ $100 that you are interested in. They are both not high resolution amplifiers when compared to more expensive solid state amps that I consider high resolution such as the Schiit Jotunheim $400, the Sinxer SA-1 $540, and the Headamp Gilmore Lite mk2 $800. The detail is just not there with most headphones when I use any of my cheap headphone amps including the two Schiit amps you are interested in.
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The exception that you mentioned is with the Hifiman Sundara $350. It sounds pretty much good on any of my collection of solid state amplifiers. And, the Hifiman Sundara sounds best only by a slight margin paired with my Headamp Gilmore Lite mk2.
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You also mentioned the Audeze LCD-X $1000. On my collection of amplifiers, my Audeze LCD-X (2020) performed best with the SCHIIT JOTUNHEIM (used $300) That pairing created an open lively present soundstage and rounded guitar tones came alive. Another note, is that in order to achieve passable good sound on all amps, the LCD-X always required EQ. The order preference of my other solid state amps that paired well are favored in the following order
2nd - SINGXER SA-1 $540
3rd - HEADAMP GILMORE LITE MK2 $800
4th - HEADAMP GILMORE LITE (discontinued)
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I don’t own the Focal Clear. I do own the Focal Elegia which is an entirely different animal. So, this is not very helpful but it also required much EQ to go from okay to very good. It paired best with my HEADAMP GILMORE LITE MK2.

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2626

Thanks for the explanation! I’m pretty similar with audiophile terms but had never heard about glare before. If I get the elex for $600 I could use them for abit and sell them and then get the clear. As you said the elex are impossible to actually buy from a retailer in the UK so I’d probably break even selling them. To me she it comes to hobbies a I don’t look at resell value but audio is probably the exception as you do actual upgrades. My end game would be the either the clear or the lcd x, I need to try them out, and the bifrost 2 I’m unsure for the amp probably the jot or the rebel amp.

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2627

Wow is that one long reply! Will use this format for future purchases. I’m sure I’m going to be very happy with the sundara w/ Asgard 3 and modi. I have a decent sense of what I want and the sundara fit that well especially for the other good options in that price range, the hd600 aren’t for me prefer something with better bass and the Zeus are too warm for my liking. I think what I’d do is get the elex or clear or lcdx keep the Asgard and modi when I have more cash upgrade my amp to either the rebel amp or jot and then give my dac some love and get the bifrost or something else. I’d sell all old gear so can put that money towards the upgrades. Going to go to richer sounds tomorrow actually so will get a taste of some gear. Bit of a side track but I usually have morale qualms with getting employees to let you try a product and tell you about it and then you don’t buy it but with shops which sell headphones they expect it and they probably don’t think you’re going to make a decision there and then plus especially in stores where it is their specialty to sell audio gear the people there are audiophiles so there happy to talk about the products even if they don’t get a sale.

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2628

Thanks for the amp recommendations! A lot of options in $400-600 amp market especially compared to the the markets below that in price

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2629

It’s the sweet spot of the whole range to my ears. You get most of what can be got, and will have to spend multiples to meaningfully uipgrade from a Rebel, or a Jot2 or a Bottlehead Craack, all at or under $500ish.

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2630

The Bottlehead Crack that you suggest is also a VERY intriguing amplifier. Each of my tube amplifiers do either one of two things. They either bring me so much more performance per dollar, and/or they bring more more enjoyment than any other solid state amplifier can bring. Bottlehead Crack is a highly regarded amplifier that may be in my very distant future.

2631

I wouldn’t sweat it. The shops are used to people trying things and not buying them. A good one will know that it’s better, in the long run, to make sure customers have a good time trying out stuff because those same customers will remember it and be more likely to buy something down the line. For me the key thing, when you decide to buy, is to go back and get the item from the brick and mortar shop and not from Amazon.

It’s been a long time since I’ve stepped in a Richer Sounds - the Brighton one was my local, back in the day - but I always found the staff to be cool, knowledgeable and enthusiastic. Anyway, enjoy your auditions tomorrow - let us know how you get on!

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2632

That was the norm before the rise of online shopping. You had to pay a little (or a lot) more for the convenience of local inventory and the ability to demo, but testing can make or break a sale. It can also help to avoid costly errors. If you want that kind of experience…buy from them or they’ll go out of business… Many people decided to run mediocre retailers out of business (e.g., Walmart killed numerous small town business districts in the US), but some good retailers and those serving narrow niche markets survive.

2633

My 2 cents: audeze. More bass than sundara, not warm and still super clear. I always recommend the lcd-xc over the lcd-x. But go try the line if you can and make your own determination. Focal clear may fall under this, but I can’t say, I haven’t heard it.

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2634

The one problem with auditioning headphones in a shop is you don’t know if they’ve been broken in or if so, for how long. Some headphones don’t sound at all like they did out of the box after being broken in for 150 hours or so; some sound downright awful out of the box but they settle down after a good bit of playing…

2635

Sure, it’s worth asking if the headphones have been burned in. I suppose a good retailer ought to know which products should be burned in.

I wouldn’t advise people to not audition headphones, though, on the basis of an unknown, hypothetical issue.

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2636

Question re DACs - for my office system, I have a pair of nice enough Audioengine HD3 speakers. Looking for a great DAC under $1000, and also wondering in particular whether y’all prefer the Bitfrost 2 to the iFi Micro iDSD Signature. I have the Bitfrost on order but while I wait and wait and wait, wondering about my options. Thanks!

2637

Schiit DACS are top notch as I own four of their Modi 3 and 3 plus models. The Bifrost 2 as you likely know, is THE DAC in demand. You order it and are placed on a waiting list because everyone wants it including me. I would just wait it out for yours to arrive. I can’t imagine you not enjoying it considering all of the praise that it has received. Plus, they are selling used for the same price as new since the demand is so great and people don’t want to wait. So, if you end up not wanting it after listening to it, you can sell it within the first minute you post it for sale for the same amount that you paid for it.

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2638

Let’s toss aside the ifi unit. Is the Chord Qutest worth the extra $$$ over the Bitfrost? I have the TT2/M-Scaler for my main system and love them. And qutest immediately available. But is it $1000 better (if at all)?

2639

I hope someone else that has listened to both can chime in here. Because, Chord products are beyond reach of my wallet.

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2640

@Sturosen are you looking for a DAC that comes as close as possible to the sound of your TT2? If that’s the case, then isn’t your question “I really like my TT2. Does Chord have a “house sound” and if so, how close will a Qutest get me to my TT2?”

I’m just asking because any answer you get to “what’s the best?” or “is it $1000 better?” is likely to be subjective.

I went through DAC analysis paralysis recently, and after going back and forth for weeks, I ended up deciding that I already had a comfort level with Schiit because I had a BF2, and bought an Yggy. I’m not saying the Yggy is better than the equivalent Chord or Holo DACs, just that it met my requirements.

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2641

Well, that is my question, in a way. Or, I guess I’d put it: I love the Chord house sound, and how similar is Bitfrost 2 for $1000 less?

But you do get to the heart of the paralysis - if I know what I like, perhaps that’s the way to go…thanks!

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2642

@Torq kind of went in that direction in this thread:

He may provide a direct response too.

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2643

The type of headphone I am looking for is Open Back

My price range is: $500-$1500

I like to listen to: A wide range of music

I will be using them for Home Office.

I currently have the Hifiman Sundara and the Beyerdynamic TYGR 300R. I find myself using the 300R more often than the Sundara simply due to it being much lighter and more comfortable to wear for 8-10 hours/day.

I’m looking for an upgrade to them. I was considering the HE 6SE V2 for $650, but was talked out of it due to how much power it needs and its weight being very heavy. While I did not hear them, from what I read, they are the sonic characteristics I am looking for. Neutral signature with good slam in the bass.

Sonically I am looking for a headphone that has good sub-bass, natural timbre, solid mids, and not too spicy high end. I find too much “air” frequencies makes headphones sound unnatural.

What are some options that will out perform the headphones I currently have sonically, but also be comfortable to wear all day? (I’m in FL so it’s pretty warm here)

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