Even more ridiculous is when you find yourself thinking that lower priced NOS tubes of the same variety are somehow defective. Ive done that and I’ve had to slap myself a few times.
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Be careful to think tubes are all in balance, harmony and integration?
I have tube amps here that you would find very SS like…amazingly so.
The tube important as it is, is only as good as the circuit its placed in…and some tube designs are very dependant on the design over a particular brand of tube or how old it is thats inserted into the circuit.
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I was referring to all the components in the chain (with their standalone elements and combined synergies) contributing to what hits your ear. Tube distortion can be a beautiful thing.
I’m hoping to find a tube amp that offers the pros of a tube amp without sacrificing too much.
Thanks for your insights on the tube dependency and circuitry, I’ll be sure to keep that in mind. I’m going to move on to narrowing down/selecting the tubes after actually demoing the amps (for those available in my area) with their stock setup.
If thats the case, "without sacrificing too much:…then most likely a hybrid tube amp might be what your looking for…IMO
The circuit has waaaaaay more influence on the sound of the amp. A tube has a set of operating requirements. Their is a finite range of operation where a vacuum tube is most efficient and this ususally is in the linear protion of tubes operation.
Tube amp circuits usually have more distortion and some tube circuit designers use circuit “tricks” to add, and remove distortion to provide that “euphonic” sound that is often characteristic of tube amps.
Zillions of articles on all this.
Doc at BH often chimes in on the NOS tube replacements for his head amps touting “Its the circuit that has more effect than any tube you plug in” and he often adds " the Crack circuit as designed is about as good as it gets"…but if you want to try different tubes, just make sure the Crack circuit can handle the differing tubes operating characteristics or you might see some smoke coming out if it!! or have more distortion that you might want!!! lol
One tube amp that I have that is a parafeed OTL amp with EL84’s is so dang clean sounding (less than 5% THD) its hard to tell its a tube amp at all…even with the high THD!
Its a great pastime and tube amps are really neat!! Enjoy your journey!!
Alex
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That was a great post, thank you for so much informative and valuable information. This went above and beyond my expectations for rich information about amps for ZMF headphones - thank you.
To add to the conversation, I found the Pendant and the ampsandsound Big Ben (this latter is an older model, I believe) to make for an excellent pairing with the Vérité open. And don’t take my wonky word for it - Zach had these two setups (with an Yggy DAC, if memory serves) at CanJam in NY this year.
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True about a hybrid, but they’re not as much fun to look at. I kid. I hate being audio Goldilocks.
I get it regarding the importance of the circuit. Thanks for your input and giving me stuff to noodle on. Let’s hope my distortion levels don’t come with smoke!
That parafeed you describe sounds awesome!
I live in Southern California and trying the Feliks, Schiit, LTA at retailers is fairly easy; I’m waiting to hear back from Decware about any demo locations; I should reach out to ampandsound for the Kenzie/Pendant.
The first time I heard the wonder of tubes was 20 years ago, and you never forget. Looking forward to the journey, thanks!
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Well if your into “looks” theres noting that in SS land that compares to a bunch of glowinng tubes for sure…and if your wallet is thick enough there are a multitude of great choices!!
Decaware, Mapletree, Woo Audio etc all will take your money willingly and you will get a great amp to “glow” at!! ha!! 
Two parafeed amps that I am familiar with are the TUBA, low cost, EL84 that runs “wide” open…what you put into it comes out good or bad. The other is the ECP Audio T4 a 10/10 tube amp…
But both of these dont have the “looks” you might want…
Let us know what you finally wind up with…sharing is half the fun!!
Alex
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If you really want a looker of a tube amp, the Decware Zen Torii lights up like a Christmas tree. It’s a speaker amp though. https://www.decware.com/newsite/TORII.htm
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I kid, looks are a tiebreaker only if all else is equal! My wallet ain’t thick and price-performance is important to me.
If I didn’t need a preamp output, I’d most likely get the TUBA. I’ll keep notes on the T4 (10/10), but a bit higher than my $1500 budget and no preamp output I believe.
I’ll keep you posted and the community has been awesome!
I like your Christmas tree reference ha. That’s a nice looking amp, but doesn’t really suit my need at the moment. Thanks.
Cayin also has some popular stuff at varied price ranges. Not sure what their preamp options on those amps are though.
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Thanks - I’ll give those a closer look.
I’m hopping into the middle of all this to ask totally noob questions, with some context:
Context: I listen on my PC almost exclusively (let’s ignore my PlayStation). I have an SMSL SP200 (THX 888), which has more than enough power for my (and most) needs. I have a few headphones, but the ones I use 99.99% of the time are my Focal Clear. I have intentions of ordering a ZMF Verite open, which will likely replace my Clear for the 99% uptime.
Questions: When access to something that’s supposed to be as transparent and powerful as one of the THX amps, is the point of getting different amps to add coloring compliments to a headphone? And, is that a choice made to create a [relatively] simple synergy, as opposed to messing about with EQ to find the tonality preferred?
Ultimate goal of asking: since I am entirely content with messing about with system-wide EQ, I’m wondering if there’s any benefit from spending more on a different amp.
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One man’s transparent and powerful is another man’s sterile, dry, and lifeless. Point being, it’s a matter of perspective. That perspective changes the more you experience different gear. Eventually you find a set of gear that just clicks and sounds amazing… to you. Go with that, and don’t let herd mentality, preconceived notions, and/or peer pressure tell you that something you liked is bad or wrong.
I believe that most of us get into the hobby with some kind of preconceived notion that absolute neutrality is best for the gear we buy. It is the ultimate goal. As the artist intended. Wire with gain.
I also believe that the more combinations of gear we have meaningful experiences with, that this concept of ‘ultimate neutrality is paramount’ inevitably will fracture.
When I say meaningful experiences, I am talking about items we have owned or had on loan for weeks at a time. Items used in our day to day lives. Not items we spent 5 minutes with at a noisy store or trade show.
So, is the point to add color to the sound? Yes. Some amps have better staging. People may highly desire that and go after amps that highlight it. Some may want more mid focused sound to balance out a V shaped headphone.
There are tube amps out there like the Eddie Current ZDS / Aficionado which are about as anti-tubey sounding as it gets, despite the fact that they run 6+ tubes. They are transparent, clear, and hold many qualities that are often attributed to solid state amps. They do one thing that 99.99% of SS amps can’t do, and that is throw a sound stage super wide and deep that is unrivaled by anything without a thermionic valve.
As an aside - I would posit that even the THX amps add color to the sound. That all gear adds color to the sound.
One last thing - Not all headphones work well with EQ. An LCD2 will only give you so much bass before that poor little abused planarmagnetic driver starts to scream for mercy in a bad way, for example. Further, EQ can’t fix everything. Nudging a frequency up or down 3 to 5 dB to correct something you don’t like is one thing. Adjusting it by 9 or more dB probably indicates you should listen to different gear. EQ won’t give you better head-stage. EQ won’t make you like a headphone you hate.
So… Based on all of the above, I would advise newer people to the hobby of a few things. 1) System synergy is vastly more important than neutrality. 2) Reviews can’t tell you how a headphone, amp, or dac sounds. Not in a meaningful experiences kind of way. 3) If you like something, you’re not wrong. If you dislike something, you’re not wrong.
Hope that helps.
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If you are happy with your audio experience than why change anything? If you are not, then you need to figure out what you want to improve and see if it’s possible with small changes or do you need whole equipment swaps.
Some people swap stuff in and out just to see what it does, which is part of the hobby, some are forever chasing the impossible, others find an end point. You might not even know where you are in that, yet.
What @ProfFalkin states is completely correct, if you need big EQ changes then you are not happy with how your source gear sounds which should help you to evaluate what you want sonically.
Why do you think the VO to be better than the clear, if you have answered that for yourself than you are on the right path towards determining what you like and what amp may or may not improve things.
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The THX philosophy was to produce an amp that was FREE from any influence on the source material.
The straight wire with gain…
Its interesting on how they accomplish this…but many find the THX amps very clinical, cold, sterile etc when it come to the sound coming out of the amp…
It measures extraordinairly so…but to many its not all about measurements…
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I too use the Clear most of the time. However, I’m really, really skeptical and hesitant about upgrading to ZMF products. This follows from two major considerations:
- Headphones are a moving technological target and products sold tomorrow are likely to be better than those today. They suffer from wear and tear and sweat and abuse on anyone’s head. So, they are likely to depreciate steeply over time. I personally (no offense to others) see the ZMF high-grade wood and leather as negatives; they provide a luxury experience but tie up cash. This is a personal choice, as I want to allocate spending on consumables and depreciating products elsewhere.
- Many music sources were created on inferior equipment or by unskilled sound professionals. In my experience there’s little point in trying to move past the quality level of the producers. When I started playing electric guitars this became very obvious. The point of diminishing quality returns hits hard somewhere around the Clear.
I do not like the Clear with my THX AAA 789. It’s way too edgy and nervous, and magnifies every little flaw. It’s also a bit too bright. I prefer the Clear on less resolving SS amps or tube hybrids. The Clear isn’t very hard to drive.
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A piece of gear has a certain sound signature. For simplicity, let’s call it less colored (wire with gain) versus more colored (noting that these are relative terms). Some people prefer less colored for all moods and music genres; that may be similar to the goal of seeking a sound that places you in the recording studio or live venue, or as the artist/sound engineer intended. This character can be preferable for evaluating and comparing gear, but may not result in the most enjoyment of the music (including emotional).
While EQ allows for the dialed-in adjustment of the frequency response, EQ doesn’t necessarily impact the other elements of sound that an amp or DAC can do such as staging, texture, dimension, dynamics, speed. This may be overly simplistic, but I consider EQ to be a 2-dimensional adjustment, whereas amp/DAC selections have more of a multidimensional influence.
I like having different types of gear in order to enjoy variety and be able to pair with a certain type of music or mood – similar to doing barrel/horizontal/vertical tasting comparisons or brewing the same bag of coffee beans with a different type of brewing vessel.
Hope that helps.
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I can appreciate your logical perspective. Please advise if there’s a similar/corresponding point of diminishing returns for amps and DACs. Thanks.
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In my experience, DACs and amps have diminishing returns that kind of ramp up quickly, then plateau, then ramp up quickly again.
Amps
$50-$200 - Not bad stuff, just basic sound.
$200 - $600 - Pretty good stuff to be found, but wallet starts to cringe.
$600-$1200 - A few really good things, mostly stuff thats just not worth it unless you’re a heavy enthusiast.
$1200-$1999 - No man’s land for value. The list of amps I would want to own in this category could be counted on one hand. Pretend I’m missing 2 fingers while you’re at it.
$2000 - $3000+ - Some amazing amps here. This is the plateau where “returns” starts to fight back against “diminishing”. Still, the cost is prohibitive, so performance must be excellent. Ex: DNA Starlett / Stratus, ECP T4 and 3F, EC ZSD / Aficionado, Wells Milo, ZMF Pendant, etc. Past this, it’s into crazy stupid diminishing returns again.
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