Indeed but I still I chase the musical dragon lol
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For me, a DAP is all about convenience: the convenience of having a music playback device separate from my phone, or the convenience of not being tied down to a desktop system - especially for earphones, since my primary use for IEMs is portability; the convenience of being able to share a newly discovered song with a work colleague, friend or family member, etc.
I personally only use my DAP with IEMs, as I have dedicated desktop systems for over-ear headphones. I also don’t spend as much money on DAPs as I do desktop systems, as the on-the-go usage increases noise and decreases focus, thus making the differences in sound quality of the TOTL DAPs moot. So for me, DAPs are most certainly not dead, nor have they seen their last days.
Just my $0.02.
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I also still have some DAPs in use: several iPods (with different sub-sets of my library), an older iPhone w/ an actual headphone jack, and a Sony Walkman. All for slightly different use cases. Love the convenience and the dramatically better battery life.
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The DAP is dead. Long live the DAP!
It’s not dead. But it will likely stay a niche product. The only thing I could see changing that is if someone like Apple created a mainstream audiophile DAP ( basically an iPod Touch with the equivalent of an iDSD micro signature inside ). This is unlikely to happen as apple doesn’t build stuff for power users.
I would very much prefer a DAP to my iDSD signature currently. I haven’t found one I can live with, but it would be much more convenient.
While that’s true for people, they will continue to be produced.
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Agreed, I cannot see that happening. Apple goes the wireless way but not along any audiophile route. Remember the days when Apple actually used decent DAC chips in their iPods? :sigh:
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The ipod had one task: play music. Apple is generally pretty good at building single task devices. The airpods line is a great example. They are fantastic but not audiophile sound. Just fantastic regular headphones.
Apple mice (once they incorporated more than one button) are also very good.
The ipod basically set the stage for audiophiles. Apple just started it and said “no thanks” to stepping into full on audiophile products.
The airpods max are good. But apple could have upped the driver to compete sonically in that price range. It just wasn’t the priority.
Anyway, apple isn’t a threat. And may even help the industry because they are often the first step for an audiophile.
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What DAC chips did Apple use in their iPods? I had an old one (Nano?) and a newer iPod Touch and if they had more power I’d have probably not continued buying more DAPs in search of more power, more features and streaming.
Originally they were using Wolfson DACs and went back and forth a bit through various iterations. These were generally the best sounding units.
Later iterations shifted more towards Cirrus Logic.
I think some SigmaTel chips made an appearance in a couple of Nano units.
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This site has a bit of information on the used DACs:
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Thanks for the info and link. Very informative.
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DAPs will likely be here for a long time going forward (niche being niche, there will be enthusiasts who won’t care about price, and there will be luxury makers who’ll be happy to charge $5k+). For me, however, DAPs may be all but dead.
I feel like a bit of a Luddite, even not being very old, for saying this, but I do not stream, and it’s highly unlikely I ever will. Thus, while I currently play around with Android on my current DAP (the first Android device I’ve ever bought), it’s merely a curiosity.
As someone who is only interested in playing locally stored files, the fiddling I have to do to maximize battery life (and still wind up with substandard life), it’s a waste. And I don’t see the industry retreating. Streaming is all the rage, I get it. Just not for me. I don’t think I’ll be willing to pay for features I don’t want/need, while also suffering poor battery life at the same time.
The problem for me, is that the current alternatives are not very appealing either. I am stubborn in my reluctance to use my phone for entertainment consumption. I use it for voice & text (imagine that! a phone used for making phone callls!!); mostly for business. I know I’m being difficult, but I can’t help wanting what I want.
If it weren’t’ for that damn proprietary WM port connector and lack of true lineout (future-proofing concerns as I can envision more difficult to drive cans or more & more exotic IEM driver configurations; I currently have no need for extra driving power), I’d maybe just buy a Sony WM-1A, try to find someone reliable to swap in a high capacity battery, and roll into the DAP sunset.
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^^^ LOL…fine, I succumbed and said “screw it” and am getting a brand new WM1A. The more I thought about it, the more entrenched my preferences became, lmao. I’ll deal with potential issues of lack of power when/if I actually buy transducers that will actually require more juice.
I was serious though, above: once I get the WM1A, I’ll start looking around for a reputable place to send it to for a high(er) capacity battery swap at some point.
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I was almost tempted back from my switch to a) primarily AirPods Pro 2 and b) using IEMs w/ a Dongle DAC/amp and my phone otherwise, by this.
Looks very nice … certainly way better than the N8ii which was such a bizarre (visual and build) departure from what made the N8 appealing that it was hard pass.
But what the hell …
The CPU is already outdated … it’s a minor stepping of the same CPU that was in the ORIGINAL N8. I know mobile SoCs are hard to buy in small volumes … but damn, that’s an ancient piece in today’s world.
It’s shipping with a version of Android that was already out of date a YEAR AGO. And none of these things get major-version OS updates (that I’ve seen, across any brand).
And then there’s the internal storage … 256GB …
On a $5,000 DAP …
This shit is, in some cases relatively, but in some actually literally, going BACKWARDS.
My initial “Oh, that might be cool!” reaction was rapidly replaced with the familiar feeling that … the people designing this stuff are not the ones using it.
…
And then I hear a strong rumor that the iPhone 15 will have an option for 2TB of internal storage, and of course is supposed to switch to USB-C … which makes it even more usable as a DAP-alternative.
Hell, maybe I’ll relent and deal with the C9’s backasswards power/charging scheme to have some variety on top of the phone/dongle when traveling as more and more my listening time is away from home …
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I have the N7 coming in for review (next week I think) and I already thought the price was extreme but this more than doubles it… It had better make damn good coffee for me while I listen to music 
But you can get it with a set of IEMs for only 12k… tempting…
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I was, momentarily, intrigued by the notion of a $7,999 UM IEM. After all, I really liked the original MEST.
Not that I would buy such a thing … IEMs (beyond convenience options like the AirPods Pro 2) remain a “when I must” proposition.
For one thing, I really haven’t heard an IEM I like better than my EE Odin FE, though the Fir Xenon 6 was trading serious blows with them.
But more than that … I haven’t been able to deal with IEMs that use BA drivers for their bass in quite a while. Really … since hearing the AAW W900. Even $50 IEMs with DD bass drivers beat out multi-kilo-buck IEMs with BA bass drivers for me these days.
And I get 95% of the enjoyment of my Odin’s off a comparatively lowly IE600 (comfortable, and I don’t care if they get knocked about a bit) … which I’m not worried about getting knocked about.
Tis a crazy world …
Did you get to hear the Helios at all? I am not a BA bass fan but I thought that did a good job.
I haven’t.
I’m not really “looking” for new IEMs … so my BA-bass-apathy (in fact its more actual ANTI-BA-bass) just tends to have me move along the moment I see that’s how an IEM is configured.
I believe DAPs especially the high end models, will always have a niche market. There are several technologies and applications that cannot be replicated in the phone market. One example is Sony. They use special components and metals to improve upon sound. On the software side they have incorporated AI to aid in upscale of music, PCM to DSD quality 11.5mhz. They also have several applications to enhance sound signature.
They, among others, use special components … that result in, admittedly pleasant, coloration. But if it is strict, technical, objective performance they are shooting for … they are missing the bar. Even the best of them … and to a significant degree.
Certainly they beat the (now extremely rare) native outputs on most phones.
But the top 4 dongle DAC/amps show the very best DAPs of today (and an embarrassing number of high-end DACs) a clean pair of heels on any objective measure, excepting, in some cases, power output.
Which is not to say that some DAPs aren’t more enjoyable. Nor that people shouldn’t prefer them. But all the technological twatwaffle the spews forth from the marketing orifices of most DAP manufacturers isn’t translating into superior fidelity (which is only a problem when they claim that IS their goal).
And I say all of that with a pre-order in for a $5,000 DAP that the manufacturers specs say are 10-50x worse in terms of noise and distortion than the W4 at $450.
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I agree, its a tough market. Who’s to say the 10% difference in sound quality is worth the high price 
I guess i am biased just went out and purchased the new Sony nw-wm1zm2. But i have to say, I love the sound qualities, and there is nothing like the feel of the gold brick in hand! 
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