ARE the DAP Days REALLY over, or not?

Congrats!

I had the original WM1Z (and the A before that - preferred the more colored sound of the Z), and it was an excellent device. Sounded great, maybe a bit light on power for full-size cans, but you couldn’t argue with the battery life - nothing by any other manufacturer even came close.

The only reasons I wound up selling it were that a) it couldn’t do any kind of on-device streaming b) it wouldn’t work as a USB-DAC off an iPhone - so no streaming there and c) the proprietary cables were a pain in the arse. None of which are issues on the new model.

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Yes, I have the WM1Z,. I am bequeathing to my wife. It seems she really wants the gold brick as well. I am looking forward to the nw-wm1zm2, for you can stream from Tidal,Qbuz,Amazon. It supports using as DAC, and now uses usb connection for power and file transfers. So everything customers complain about is fixed. They have made significant changes to upscale capabilities and better display.

I had a chat with the Hifiman people at CanJam. Apparently HQ thinks that DAPs are out and Bluetooth is in. Honestly I don’t tend to disagree. I’d rather make my phone, which already has all the music, sound good, rather than have another device.

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I have my Sony Walkman (the generation before the current line) and love it. I use it for travel (small form factor) with IEM’s. At home, when I’m not at my “music station”, I can use 300ohm cans with the Cayin C9, which gives me great SQ. I sold my first C9, then decided I really need it so I bought another.
Else: Walkman with ANC BT IEMs when moving around the house.

I guess it all depends on the use case - which is how I think of my audiophile purchases these days. I think in terms of location, my access to power, how I am positioned (walking, sitting, etc.), WiFi access, what distractions are around, etc. For instance, I wanted to have a mobile audiophile solution with the best SQ, on battery, sitting in a quiet environment, for critical listening. I chose the Mysphere 3.2 with A&K SP3000.

I don’t need ANC in that environment. My iPhone doesn’t deliver the sound quality I wanted. I find IEM’s annoying. So I purchased a high-quality DAP and audiophile “ear speakers” to meet the needs of this use case.

I wish I had approached all my former audiophile purchases from this perspective, combining synergistic devices to satisfy the particularly use case - instead of just buying individual devices that struck my fancy.

[Full disclosure: this is my first DAP ever, and I have owned the Mysphere 3.2 in the past which I sold because I didn’t have a clear use case - they seemed redundant with my Raal Requisite SR1a, but the difference is that the Raals require a heavy desktop amp to drive them, but the Mysphere 3.2’s can be driven adequately by a powerful DAP.]

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I default to the DAP I’ve been using (iBasso 240) over phone + dongle for simple ease of use, and also for storage (the idea of using Wi-Fi to stream an infinite universe of music is nice, but in most situations where I most want to listen with headphones – planes for instance – it’s not a reliable option). The sound quality is as good as it needs to be, probably much better.

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Come to the dark side: Apple AirPods Pro. They hit a home run on practical travel functionality. This follows from sound quality that exceeds the potential to hear given aircraft noise, a tiny charging case, great noise canceling, and integration with other Apple devices. They may even help block out @pennstac’s multiple cicada hordes.

Streaming without Wi-Fi: Download 20 or 50 albums and playlists before you travel to your phone, tablet, or notebook. The services require periodic membership checks (e.g., weekly), so connect for a minute when you happen to have Wi-Fi.

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I’m sure that’s an excellent solution for many. I just don’t love ear buds in my ears. And I’m really happy with Qobuz, so adding another subscription service feels like wasted money. I also don’t really fly often enough (yet) for that to make a huge difference. But certainly I’m in the great minority on this.

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The AirPods Max is an over-ear headphone, and also may put you in touch with your feminine side (read down from here).

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Have you not met the needed Apple quota yet this month?? :smile:

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This reflects a big change for me over the years. I used to avoid arrogant, overpriced Apple in all ways. I didn’t change until after the iPhone came out and after buying Android products shortly thereafter…and regretting it becuse they were terribly unstable. Apple is still surely overpriced and arrogant, but sometimes indeed the best option.

I agree that it sometimes is, in fact, I actually bought a Mac this year due to the stupidly overpriced PC components. It has some very good things about it but also some that I really hate.

Still can’t bring myself to buy pods, pads or phones though.

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I use Apple computers. Having now invested $2500 in my travel audio gear, I can’t see spending more. If I was starting from scratch that might be an appealing option.

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My personal DAP days only began in the past couple years - currently rocking a Fiio M11 Plus Ltd and love it - I wanted a single device that could hold my entire library, had headphone ports and was specifically crafted for music - basically a new more powerfule iPod, like I had in college. I started with a set of Sony MDR-1AM2 from eBay (which I still have and use pretty frequently) and am now up to a ZMF Eikon and an Astell & Kern AK PA10. I’ve got a couple bluetooth items for when i’m doing dishes or going on a walk, but if i’m just sitting chilling or in bed, i’ve got the full chain setup to the Eikons and i’m happy. I don’t even have a desktop computer that’s in use, so this suits my needs perfectly.

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This is an interesting direction.

Do you happen to know how much it would cost to have a DAP that is roughly equivalent to a Schiit or JDS Atom stack?

I’m not reaching for high end for a portable but if it gets me to the entry desktop range I can see a use case for it.

A DAP that can output 1W @32ohms to 3.5mm single-ended for approximately $250 USD?

I don’t think so

I was trying to ask what the cost would be for a dap that has sound quality similar to an entry level desktop stack.

I wouldn’t need the full power output to use iem’s or efficient dynamic headphones.

Another question in the same spirit is at what price level do daps have better sound quality than bluetooth?

Well, at $175 USD, you can get the HiBy R3 II. I have a previous version of this guy which is called the HiBy R3 Pro, and I like the sound quite a lot, but only for IEMs. Not even the Koss Porto Pro worked, even via balanced, to my satisfaction. It can stream via WiFi Tidal and Qobuz (without offline downloads), but can also act as a streaming remote endpoint for phones, tablets, and computers via various different protocols.

Here’s a good introductory video:

Thanks for the info in the R3.

I might look farther up the line to have a unit that works equally well with headphones but it’s good to know that the starting point is $175 instead of $!,000!

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I use my dap daily. I think its the only chain that of something broke I would replace it exactly.

Cowon Plenue S > PlusSound x8 > Focal Radiance

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