Classical Music Discussion

Yes, he does go quiet. He seems to have no fear of it. There were times I wanted to crank up a certain passage but since I knew what was coming I resisted. I think it provides more focus to the music, forcing you to peer into it.

However, what you stated about environmental noise being a potentially more prevalent issue is true.

His last few symphonic releases have all been single compositions.

I was reading some of his liner notes, that he himself wrote, I think for Mahlers 6th… he’s a different duck.

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Well recorded, great performance:

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I’ll check it out but if its some Phil Glass clone Imma be upset :wink:.

Actually so far its interesting and it is very well recorded. I am detecting a structure so its a good start. Theres a lot of competition going on between the instruments but it still manages to hold its own.

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I particularly enjoy the quality of the recording on the pizzicato sections, lovely.

Brahms Requim for me this morning. Listening to the Karajan which is a new recording to me, I own the SFO from 1993 album, and haven’t really studies the piece so never took the time to investigate alternative recordings. @FLTWS has inspired me out of my comfort zone!

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It is a truly top shelf recording. The strings just hang in the air and everything is crisp and full bodied. Im going to try and remember the recording labels to see if they have consistent quality. I try to keep track of which houses do well and which need improvement. Helps me keep an ear on my system since I run tubes.

I havent heard all of it but “Plan and Elevation” was really nice. There’s something about it that is absorbing, an intensity and deliberateness to it all (Im reading too much Gramophone).

Plus, she borrows from other pieces of music and it is driving me bonkers trying to place it! Its just out of reach for my brain at the moment. I may have to search through my playlists to figure it out.

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It’s one of the French quartets, Ravel or Debussy, I have to go back and listen again but they are always recorded together and I cannot remember which is which as they were both favorites of mine for hallucinogenic listening in high school, so they bleed together, but it is one or the other of those

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YES! ZOMG. That was really bugging me. I think it’s Ravel but tbh they blend together.

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Yes. It’s the Ravel. Thanks.

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I have never read gramophone. Is it best to get a subscription, or just peruse the website? There also seem to be podcasts. Where should I start?

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I just browse the website, I havent looked at it in a couple of months but a lot of it was freely available at the time, back issues/archives may require a fee. I should glance at it this weekend. I still find it really neat to see a recommendation online and then have it up and streaming in seconds. I use primephonic for classical which carries a lot, outside of Hyperion, so I dont have to bother with any Tidal f**kery to get good quality steams.

I mostly look at it for info on new releases that may be of interest. They also have playlists for some of the more big name composers that contain recordings of interest. It was a good place for me to begin when I started to get in to classical.

Ive never listened to their podcasts. Their recommendations are hit and miss, just like anything in music when you are relying on opinion. Ive never been recommended anything truly awful, just not always to my taste. Some of the reviews can be humorous given the ostentatiousness of the language. Sometimes they turn me on to a real gem I wouldnt have otherwise been aware of. Its a decent resource.

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I blame @FLTWS

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:smiley: Enjoy! This set is as cost effective as it is a quality re-mastering and great overall cycle.
(That looks like a “Crack” amp behind the box).

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Yes, I need to figure out why it’s blowing fuses all of a sudden, so it’s on the desk in the “in box”.

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Awesome. I guess a couple of the symphonies will be split between discs.

Do you have a CD transport or just going to rip them?

I had big plans to buy CD copies of my favourite classical albums and get a transport but that never materialized. Streaming is just too easy and I am always hopping around the classical universe.

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Both a and b, I do have a transport, but I will also rip these.

What I’ve found is that spending a little bit makes my brain value things at a higher level, and engage with them more, so in this case, where I would like to become familiar with this body of symphonic work, purchasing them is the first part of a commitment.

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I see the logic behind that and support it!

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Mahler 6 “Tragic”: Vanska with Minnesota on BIS
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87 minutes on one SACD / CD?

Sound: Superb recording, European Orchestra Layout – you’ll notice it in the opening bars with double basses and cellos left. The recording was made in the Minnesota Orchestra’s regular concert hall and this is one of the best recording acoustics I’ve heard, nice and tight with a hint of ambience, keeps fine details from getting lost in a blur. This recording captures dynamic range so well; pppp’s are clearly captured and heard and ffff’s don’t distort. Horn and brass voices really come out in a way most recordings don’t capture them. Mahler’s youth growing up was spent in a town that had a military barracks and its own marching band, Mahler’s early music exposures were definitely sewn into his adult compositional style and this recording give a full measure of horn and brass details brought to the fore. This is not just a consequence of the recording quality I suspect but also Vanska’s balancing of the different orchestra sections as well. Another master of getting horn and brass balances right was Tennstedt. Loads of various instruments not generally used are in play here also; glockenspiel, xylophone, deep bells, rute, wood sticks, cowbells, celeste, and several triangles.

1st movement: “Tragic” – Mahler himself referred to this title on many occasions for his 6th. While I prefer a bit more snap in the tympani for the Mahler rhythm appearances (dum, dum, _da-dum, dum, dum), Vanska’s pacing create a genuine mood of foreboding throughout even if the movement ends in a triumphant manner. Well done.

2nd or 3rd Scherzo/ 2nd or 3rd Andante, movements: Mahler himself couldn’t decide which should be 2nd or 3rd. Vanska puts the Andante 2nd and Scherzo 3rd. I prefer the opposite. Probably 95% of all the recordings of the 6th (and 2 live performances) I’ve encountered put the Scherzo 2nd and the Andante 3rd and I think the symphony works better that way. This performance puts the Andante 2nd and Scherzo 3rd. With CD it’s easy to reorder the movements anyway you like with the push of a button.

The Scherzo: This movement always strikes me as a little bizarre by intent, like a picture viewed through a distorted lens. It’s basically dark in mood but in a twisted sort of way and mixed with elements of straight forward, gentle, waltz like sections which makes the movement all the more a bit unstable in atmosphere. It makes a nice contrast to the certainty of the 1st movement and it does end (the last 4 minutes or so), in a very low key state that could mate to the 4th movement okay.

Andante: “But”, I prefer the escape to the peaceful realm the Andante presents before we enter the 4th movements massive, and other worldly realm. So, Scherzo 2nd and Andante 3rd for me. Vanska does an excellent job just falling a little short of the buildup and release of the “Big Tune” at the end of the Andante that Karajan manages with those fabulous Berlin Philharmonic musicians. The details of all the previously mentioned percussion instruments used are very well captured by BIS.

The Finale : in the first minute or so that ominous theme from Schubert’s “Unfinished” symphony 1st movement appears and that will be brought back in the closing bars of this movement to preface the extraordinary orchestral explosion that closes the symphony. Again I like the Karajan a hair better but he does not get the extra fine details as well recorded.

I was planning on doing a comparison of all 19 different recordings of the 6th in my collection but I’ve been so taken by this Vanska / Minnesota/BIS recording I may move on to Vanska’s 5th and complete Mahler’s middle symphonies with this conductor, orchestra, and recording team, and the 7th I recently listened to and a short review of it posted last month on this thread . Maybe I’ll cover all the Vanska/Mahler’s I have. #3, #8, and #9 have yet to be recorded (?)/ released.

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I may need to listen to this version - your review makes it sound like a winner.

I forgot to put this in my review

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I did my own version of the Mahler 7 comparison, using whatever CDs I could get from my library. All mine were already on @FLTWS’s list so I’ll just list them by conductor.
Bernstein (1965)
Kubelik
Abbado
Chailly
Gielen
Zinman
Fischer
Vanska

As a disclaimer, I don’t know enough about the intricacies of classical music to know why I like or dislike a particular performance, so this won’t be heavy on the explanation. I tend to listen to the performance and see if it resonates with me, and I let my subconscious deal with why it does or doesn’t resonate. I realize that this means my rambling won’t be as helpful as his.

As another disclaimer, I’d never heard Mahler 7 before. Luckily, I found out that I love it. Thanks to @FLTWS for starting this - it’s been fun.

I wasn’t quite sure how to do this, so I compared the first movement of each performance, and then the second, and so on.

2 performances stood out for me: the Bernstein (1965) and the Vanska. I knew this because those were the 2 where I’d consistently forget to skip to the next conductor when the movement was over. This happened several times.

I also liked the Gielen and Abbado but not quite as much as the other two.

The Chailly seemed dull, as @FLTWS pointed out. I liked the performance of the Kubelik but didn’t like the sound, and I’ve come to realize that the quality of the recording is important to me (so I guess no scratchy pre-war recordings for me). The performance comes first of course, but then sound quality.

The other performances were all fine, but didn’t impact me as much as my top 4.

When I was finished, I was a little disappointed that I didn’t like the Chailly because I’m a big fan of his other recordings, so I gave him one last chance. The difference was that this was the only Mahler I listened to today so there was nothing for my brain to compare it to. Lo and behold, I loved it. I can’t explain why I consistently hated it the last few days and loved it today, other than his performance was different enough from the others that it didn’t seem as good in comparison.

So Chailly controversially joins Bernstein and Vanska as my top 3 Mahler 7’s.

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