I’m hoping Alan can help me find some headphones that will work well (if not optimally) with my Rega amp, because spending additional money on a headphone amp is not something I’m up for. I don’t think I’d be using it enough to justify it and it’s another piece of gear I’d have to find room for… no, I’m not going that route, there’s gotta be a make and model that will serve me well with what I’ve got…
Another question: what about ‘burning in’ headphones, is it really a big deal? If that is so, then I never burned in my Clears, just played them a few hours and put them away after the headband kept sliding down my head. Whatever I buy and wherever I buy it, I will need to have a return option and a sound strategy for testing them out during the return period. Even comfort is a factor that can take breaking in over a period. My PM3 phones were vice grip tight the first time I wore them but now they are super comfy and tight enough not to slip (it’s a pretty light headphone anyway, and it seems it is weight and mass that cause slippage, as well as a loose clamping force).
In my opinion “burn in” isn’t a thing to worry about and it is more a question of pads taking the shape of your head than driver “evolution”.
If you adapted to a clampy headphones you can take a look at Sennheiser HD660s: lightweight, 150 ohm and very sensitive they can be driven out of anything. Initial clamp force is tight but you can gently work on the metal part of the band to fix it. They are good headphone with “a little more” than the rest of the 6x0 series: a little more bass, more air on high frequencies, more soundstage.
I use my 660s a lot and really like them. Consider also that being 150ohm they don’t change so much in performance according to the amp you use and they can give you a good result with your equipment.
In years past I was in your camp, but I’ve flipped. Both the DAC and the amp can absolutely transform headphones. I’d often rather listen to cheaper headphones on solid upstream gear than vice versa, as they sound smoother and fuller this way. The $200-$300 Sennheiser HD-600 and HD-6XX can be satisfying with the right upstream support.
You might benefit from the small $100 to $200 mobile Bluetooth battery-driven headphone DAC/amps over the Rega. These devices are smaller than a pack of playing cards, but designed for headphones alone. @elliot recently joined this forum and we sent him toward this type of minimal setup, but he then flipped to becoming a hardcore buyer. As always, you must try for yourself.
In my experience the impact ranges from nothing to modest. Dynamic drivers such as the Clear do open up and smooth out a bit to my ears, but usually not much. Still, I often set new dynamic headphones to play for 24-48 hours with moderately loud music. The Clear is indeed a very clear headphone and much of its character comes from the DAC and amp. I don’t like it at all on some setups, but never had a problem with its fit.
I get what your saying. The question for me is perhaps what is an acceptable compromise, given the headphones won’t sound its best with a sub-par amp, can I find a pair that will still sound “very good” with my present amp, until someday when I find the money and the will to get a headphone amp into the picture. Alan will be able to give me some guidance, and if he says I must get an amp, well then, I’ll have to mull that over and start whittling down my credit card balance over time.
They are great, especially for the soundstage they give you and for the 120ohm impedance that make them extremely easy to drive. My son gifted me a pair on my birthday and I love them for jazz and classical music. Great hint. Also for the problems @Ferrara had with the Clear I believe these ones can work well for him: no metal parts like on 6x0 series and with softer ear pads, they sit well on head without give the sensation you can loose them.
I don’t think anyone is saying you have a sub-par amp. I would doubt if many US-based members of this forum have heard any Rega gear beyond their acclaimed turntables, and it’s hard to recommend headphones without first-hand experience with your amp. That means you’re going to have to try some different models to see if you like them, and if you don’t like them, report your findings back to the forum, because that will give people a better idea of what you might like.
Those numbers mean little to me, but if they give me any pointers for looking for headphones with specs that are more likely to be compatible, please tell me what kind of specs I should look for in headphones.
If you want to make sense of those numbers, and how they relate/apply to headphone specifications, then you have some math/physics to learn.
At a high level, you’ll need to learn ohms law and how to calculate (or use a calculator for) determining power requirements for headphones based on impedance and sensitivity. And you’ll also need to know how loud you listen.
Note that, in general, the rule of thumb for determining required amplifier power is:
Determine your normal listening level in dB/SPL.
Add 20 dB to that (for musical peaks, though if you only listen to electronics music, 10dB is likely fine).
Figure out how much power you need to hit that listening level.
Double it, to allow for amplifier headroom (to keep the amplifier in its sweet spot).
For reference, the Brio’s headphone output is capable of about 125mW into loads from 32 to 300 ohms. Which is about the same as some of the USB-dongle DAC/amps.
If you don’t want to do that, the bite the bullet and spend ~$100 on any one of several headphone amplifiers (Schitt, JDS, Geshelli), and feed it from the “Record Out” on your Brio. At which point, within your budget, amplifier power/drive is something you can largely forget about.
Regardless, the Brio really doesn’t have the current delivery to deal with low impedance planar headphones, nor inefficient headphones in general.
So I am indeed coming around to the notion that I will need a good headphone amp to augment my headphones purchase, especially if I’m intent on exploring one of the Aeon models as a possibility. I’m not so much bummed by having to spend more money on an amp (which means postponing things till I can whittle down my Visa balance), but the addition of one more AC powered component to my system is going to mean not enough outlets in my Furutech power conditioner, so I will feel compelled to get a new one of those with eight outlets since six won’t be enough to support all my audio components. But that’s another story…
Being still rather fixated on the Dan Clark Aeon for its comfort factor (haven’t read any condemnations of its sound, either), I found an informative review of the Aeon Noire (of the three Aeons, the one I’m most interested in) that contrasts the Noire with the 2 closed and gives some suggestions on what model of amp will pair well with these phones: Topping A90 and Schiit Asgard 3. The reviewer opines that the Topping would be the superior choice but that the Asgard would do the job well at less than half the price. Either amp, added to the $900 selling price of the Aeons, would still get me in under $1500 for this purchase. But then there’s the expense of a new power conditioner, arghh…
Any opinions on these two above named amps and their suitability for DCA headphones? Talking with Alan later today and I’m sure he’ll have some thoughts (which may steer me in a different direction).
If you are looking to save money, an “adequate” amp will likely have a 1000x more positive impact on Dan Clark headphones than a power conditioner. You may wish to consider the benefits of the Jotunheim or Lyr too.
I know it doesn’t help to give you more choices, but the same reviewer talked about the synergy between the Schiit Jot 2 and various DCA headphones in a review later in the year. He used the Jot 2 with the phono card, paired with his Rega turntable, which I thought you might find interesting. And I’ve seen others in the forum talk about the Schiit Lyr 3 working well with DCA.
Edit: @generic just said the same thing while I was typing LOL.
^ This. Unless the power is truly in need of conditioning, I’d put the money toward the amp and headphones.
@Ferrara I’d personally go with something from Schiit over Topping. Better reliability, more flavors of sound and an easier to work with customer service team. Just my $0.02.
I own both Noire and Asgard.
To my tastes while the Asgard has the power to drive the Noire it softens too much the headphones. But these are my tastes.
I believe a Lyr 3 will synergise better with DCA headphones. Noire responds very well to tubes, getting a good sense of impact, detail and soundstage.
Just my two cents.
Jotunheim and Lyr are on my list for amps to consider now, thanks. The former has a balanced jack on the front panel in addition to the standard 1/4", anyone want to speak to the benefits of that in terms of sound performance?
I have a dummy question: Where will a typical headphone amp fit in the signal chain? I assume it will connect with my Brio amp via the L/R RCA record out jacks on the back panel, right? Do the models of headphone amps we’re discussing have L/R RCA jacks to connect to the main amp?
Relative to the 1/4" TRS jack on the Jotunheim, the balanced output will give you more power (7.5W for XLR, 2.4W for TRS into 16 ohms), double the slew rate (usually results in better transients and impact), better separation and lower crosstalk.
Usually they’re fed directly from a DAC or other line-level source.
In your case, yes, you’d feed it off the “Record Out” sockets on your Brio.
Everything @Torq said, plus I tried my AEON Flow with a variety of balanced and single-ended amps. To my ears balanced added nothing at all, and they weren’t my favorites. The more powerful amps were always better, to include the Lyr 3. However, balanced adds versatility and may be superior over the single-ended output of a given amp (e.g., Jot single versus Jot balanced).
I still prefer balanced amps for the dynamic driver Sennheiser HD-600, as it’s a noise and hiss freak.
