You’re already very high end, if not top end. So it’s going to be difficult to simply find places to make noticiable improvements. The limitation is headphones. If you don’t mind making some noise, then some people augment headphones with some type of subwoofer in the room. Can be quite annoying to others, but there’s your bass.
I also listen to both classical and classical Indian music, among other genres. I think that other than an outside-the-headphone solution, you have your work cut out for you, especially in terms of bang for the buck.
There are not going to be a lot of “cost effective” improvements to that chain.
There are clear steps up in Amps and DAC’s, but the RAAL’s severely limit the options for the latter, and any step up is going to be a significant outlay, I’d say 2-3K used for an obvious improvement at DAC, and you really only have one other choice in Amps if you don’t change headphones.
I have yet to use any headphone chain that produces an image in front of me (outside binaural recordings), even headphones like the MySpheres and RAAL’s while I think they have a speaker like presentation don’t image like speakers.
You obviously can do a lot better on the Bass front, but probably not with the RAAL’s, I do know people who run Subwoofers with them to provide a more visceral experience, but it may not be practical in your setting.
I personally wouldn’t do the preamp thing on headphones, but it’s your money.
Streamers can make a big difference, they will generally make things blacker, clean up the stage a bit and possibly improve dynamics some. All they are doing is decoupling you from a noisy PC USB connection. The Bifrost2 already has decent USB isolation, it will be a noticeable change, but subtle.
I also wouldn’t over spend on a streamer without upgrading your other source gear first, something like the ZenStream, a microRendu, or just a raspberry Pi based solution probably makes sense, anything higher up the ladder probably doesn’t
Where would you go for an entry-level or high-value planar magnetic cans if Chinese made were off the table?
Use case is basically one headphone for listening at work, which is a high school classroom, but not very noisy, so I think open-back is fine. I’m not a bass head or a detail freak; if I were to pick one attribute that matters most to me it would be honest midrange tone, perhaps leaning gently to the warm side of neutral. I don’t want to put a budget on this, because I’m partly interested in where the experts think the entry level really is once some obvious things like HE400 and Sundara are out of the picture.
A sentence or two regarding what you like most about your recommendation would also be much appreciated.
Your two major choices are Audeze or Dan Clark Audio, both manufactured in California.
But you will pay more than you would for “value” HiFiMan cans because neither Audeze nor DCA have “value” products in their respective lineups. The cheapest decent Audeze is the LCD-1, and that costs $400 new. Dan Clark’s cheapest is the Aeon Open RT or Aeon Closed RT (or it’s X versions at Drop), which cost $500.
Almost every planar needs an amp to run at sufficient volume and fidelity, so that will be an additional expense.
I get why people don’t want to buy HiFiMan. Don’t want to support China, worries about quality control, etc. But HiFiMan has cleaned up its QC act quite a bit in the last couple of years, and no headphone manufacturer has a lineup with more value for money than HiFiMan, especially with models like the HE-400se ($150), Sundara ($350) and Edition XS ($500).
You’re missing out if you exclude those models from your purchasing decisions. Sure, the Audeze and DCA are just as good as some of the competing HiFiMan planars. But you’re going to pay more. In some cases, a LOT more.
These routinely go on sale for $379 or so at Drop.com.
Indeed. @Lou_Ford – You’ll need a desktop amp to move beyond fair-to-mediocre performance. If buying USA products for everything, Dan Clark’s product will be “okay” with a $100 Schiit Magni 3+. They’ll sound better with a $300 to $500 Schiit Jotunheim 2 or Lyr 3.
I and others recommend the Dan Clark closed model but not the open. See @Resolve’s review on this website.
If you can change your requirement to include Chinese manufactured planar magnetic headphones, then I would recommend the Monoprice M1570 that can be found on sale sometimes at $450. I have not read about quality control problems with the M1570 like I often read about and experience with Hifiman headphones. M1570 come with two memory foam ear pad sets, one lambskin and the other velour to please both crowds. Sound is very good but slightly inferior at technicals compared to Audeze LCD-X and Hifiman HE6SE V2. Headband quality leaves much to be desired as they are floppy because of the thin low quality metal used in the headband.
Sounds like a cheaper streamer is an easy solution. Thanks for the words of caution about not needing to get too expensive on streamers. I keep seeing these $5k, $7k, $10k streamers being reviewed and wondering what in the world they do!
@pennstac, what service do you use to stream classical (assuming you do)? After the death of Primephonic, I’ve been using iTunes on my PC. I am pretty pleased with its selection and search (I mean, all things considering), but the software is so darn buggy and clunky that it is driving me a little crazy. (I mean, how is it possible that one of the world’s biggest companies can’t make a stable application for a PC??) I am starting to look around for something better.
I use both iTunes and Qobuz. Stream on an M1 chip iPad Pro, usually from there via a short Bluetooth 5 hop across my office to an iFi Blu V2 feeding a recently board level restored (story and pic in the forum) Sansui AU-919 integrated amp driving EgglestonWorks Nico Evo speakers.
At home I go from a MacBook Pro 14 to Bifrost 2 to either a Lyr 3 for dynamic or planars, or modified STAX SRM-T1S to Nectar Hives or my ancient STAX SR5n
Like you I’ve found reasonable selection. However I’m hardly the top classical listener here. You need to join the Classical discussion thread. There is no Indian Classical discussion but there is world.
Given your taste, I wonder what you think of Tabla Beat Science. I really enjoy the mix of Indian classical info fusion.
The Zen DAC V2 has a built-in amp with balanced (4.4 mm Pentaconn) and single-ended (3.5 mm) output. You could get another amp, but you don’t need it. The Zen DAC V2 should drive your cans just fine.
Thanks for the notes / recommendations. Can anyone explain the current DCA offering at drop.com? It seems to me like an Aeon RT Closed (with different pads?) but only $20 off the price. I would think most people would spend that much more and deal directly with DCA and not wait until March. OTOH, the price seems too low to be an Aeon 2 Closed. I feel like I’m missing something that would explain the offering.
While likely not needed with @andyha1010’s headphones, other headphone models can lack bass depth and definition on the not-powerful ZenDAC amp. This includes the Senn HD 600 and 6XX.
Drop sometimes creates custom products, sometimes offers substantial discounts, and sometimes is just another retailer. They have regular sales as well. They generally name all the “unique offerings” with an “X” somewhere. This started with the Sennheiser HD 6XX, which is often described as guts of the HD 650 with midnight blue plastic parts and a much lower price tag.
Per my observations and discussion in the thread above, the DCA at Drop are likely AEON Flow generation 1 models (NOT gen 2 as available from DCA) with new pads/tuning and an X in the name.
Thanks again to all who have responded here. Do you see the Drop X Closed as better in some way than the current DCA RT Closed? Because the price is basically the same. I guess I’m still trying to figure out the point of differentiation.
