I have the “basic” Schiit stack and thinking about upgrade and stop there( if possible to stop some day). Lyr 3 is my more probably choice as for right now. Not many reviews out there, but the few of them are good. Lot of power, looks nice and @Torq like it too.
You have 14 days to returned if you are not happy with the product ( I believe they keep about 5% or something like that) and the warranty is for 5 years.
2 Likes
I haven’t heard the Liquid Platinum yet, but it is high on my want list. And at that $615 Amazon sale price right now it is super tempting. Easy re-sale at that price if you end up not liking it.
I would strongly advise against the EC ZDT Jr for planars and HE-560 in particular. Full tube amps like that are best paired with high impedance dynamics. The bass is the weakest link on that amp, which goes against one of the main reasons to own a good planar. Don’t get me wrong, I love that amp (I own it), but I never put planars on it.
If you are set on tubes then the LP or Lyr 3 are much better bets given they are hybrids. I’ve heard Lyr 3 and quite like that amp. It is very dynamic and can slam. If you are trying to stay under $500 and must have tubes, I think Lyr 3 could be your best bet.
Which Stax are you shooting for? At $700 I would highly recommend L300L and skip L700 if that is what you are thinking. I’ve done extensive side-by-sides of the two and L300L is definitely they way I would go. But I’m happy enough with my SR404, otherwise I would get the L300L.
6 Likes
Tell me more - in the STAX area. I was thinking L-700, as the only STAX I have now are my old standard bias SR-5n, which I really like.
3 Likes
Woo WA6
The Woo WA6 is probably the best value amplifier Woo sells. I’ve owned one. It’s great with dynamic headphones, but I would not personally pair it with any planar headphone, and especially not something relatively insensitive like the HE-560. Ideally it needs a rectifier upgrade out of the box too, so is going to be closer to $850 by the time you’re done with it.
EC ZDT Jr
The EC ZDT Jr would fair better, but again it’s one I don’t like with planar headphones (regardless of sensitivity). In fact I think its at its best with high-impedance cans regardless of type, despite having an output for low-impedance ones. This is likely what I’d buy if I was only driving high-impedance dynamic cans and wanted tubes.
Lyr 3
The Lyr 3 will drive anything you throw at it … and do it well. I like it a lot - it’d almost certainly be my personal pick at this price point (if I didn’t want balanced output and was going to be driving planar cans). It’s even handed, punchy, dynamic and nicely resolving. You get a little tube-flavor with it (more so than, say, the Liquid Platinum), and it benefits from a better tube than stock (the upgrade option Schiit offers is worth it, but don’t go mad), but like most tube-hybrid amps it doesn’t sound like a full-blown tube amp. And this is a line of amplifiers that was specifically built to drive power-hungry loads like the early inefficient planar designs so it’ll have no issues there.
The 4490 DAC card isn’t quite a Modi 2, and it certainly isn’t a Modi 3. It’s fine for all-in-one use if you really want the convenience, or are not listening critically, but the amp deserves better.
Liquid Platnium
The Liquid Platinum is another capable and punchy amplifier. No problem with planars here either. I think it’s a bit overhyped though as I don’t personally find it sounds much like other Cavalli designs, nor do I find it to have much in the way of “tube-flavor”. I like the aesthetic. I tend to regard it as more of a “solid state” amplifier that has tubes in the top of it, though.
Cavalli Tube Hybrid
The Massdrop CTH is a lot of fun … has a bit more tube flavor than most hybrids, and is inexpensive. It’s not perfect, and the amps above all handily beat it … excepting that’ll be fine with planars and dynamics of pretty much any impedance you care to throw at it.
I mention it primarily as for your case you might consider getting something like this for the “tube-ish” side of things, that’ll actually work well with planars and dynamics, and it’d still leave you enough budget for a proper solid-state option as well … probably the THX AAA 789 in this case.
Moving away from tubes …
THX AAA 789
Amazing measurements, lots of power, drives anything, looks nice, highly resolving with decent dynamics, something of a “purists” amp. Sonically, I find it can be a bit lean/clinical at times which can get fatiguing. Very revealing of any upstream shenanigans. I would not use it with lossy source material (something I seem to be unusually sensitive too, especially from Spotify). Would not feed it from anything other than a proper line-out.
One thing I don’t like about the THX AAA 789 is that it has a sort of “fragile” feel to it in operation. It isn’t; it’s just a perception. And probably only mine. But little things like the unit going into protection every time I plug/unplug a single-ended headphone if the volume isn’t absolutely at zero, bothers me. Don’t get me wrong … it’s good that it has such protection … I’d just prefer it if it wasn’t so obvious.
Do not get ideas about using an adapter to go from the S-Balanced output on the xDSD to the balanced inputs on this.
Jotunheim
Tons of power, great control, slams almost as well as the Lyr 3. A bit richer sounding than the THX AAA 789, with more meat on the bones to it’s presentation and a bit more low-end heft, but a bit less resolving also. Dynamics are similar. More forgiving of upstream issues. Easy to get, easy to find used, and easier to listen to (for me) for longer periods.
Excepting the Liquid Platinum (short loan of a friend’s unit) and the Lyr 3 (month or so loan for review that I’ve not written up yet), I’ve owned or own all of the above.
To cover the bases you’re talking about (for the office) I went with the combination of THX AAA 789 and EC ZDT Jr. Though that’s more than you’re budgeting, and the THX is a pain in the arse to get.
Though the chances are I am selling the entire stack here shortly, as I don’t have a place for it at home and don’t plan on spending much more time in the office.
8 Likes
I think the best bang for your buck might be to get the MCTH, while you get ready for your new Stax headphones 
Or since the THX 789 is hard to come by, for a bit more, grab the EC ZDT Jr, and the Jotunheim as a stack and you can be done for a long while =) Soo many options and choices… it will be interesting to see what you go with and your thoughts on your final purchase
4 Likes
Thank you from me too for this write up. I appreciate something like this. Such great advice thanks.
4 Likes
While my opinion is very different than @Torq, I back-to-back-to-back tested the MCTH ($250), the Loxjie P20 ($100), and the THX AAA 789 ($400 list, often $600-$700 street) with many of my headphones. These included HD-600s, HE-560s, Focal Elex, AEON Flow Closed, LCD-2 Classics, and AQ NightHawk Carbons.
Using only the balanced output on the Loxjie and balanced cables for everything, it BLEW AWAY the MCTH. The tone profiles of both are similar, with mid-low bloom and weaker deep bass than the 789. However, the high end of the MCTH was muted, fizzy, flat, or dead. The Loxjie had much better definition, clarity, and life.
I then sold the MCTH as I was never, ever using it.
After that I grabbed a matched set of GE Triple Mica tubes for the P20 (about $30 from Ebay; see the Loxjie P20 thread) and back-to-back tested it against the 789. It still has more mid-low bloom and less deep bass than the 789. However, the overall presentation in the mid-high range is similar. But, the 789 has notably better details (it takes no prisoners).
2 Likes
AND THE WINNER IS:
Schiit Lyr 3 with Tung-Sol Tube upgrade
-
Did not want to give up using the Hifiman phones, so that let out the WA6 and Eddie Current.
-
@Torq confirmed that the Liquid Platinum was not very tubey, although good
-
Balanced output was not an overriding concern. I don’t really like keeping a lot of extra cables handy to use for balanced output. Maybe someday I’ll change that thought.
-
Nobody had a bad thing to say about the chosen product
Thanks to all of you who weighed in on this. I may yet pick up an Atom just to keep at the State College house. Or, if someone has a THX AAA 789 for sale I could go with that. I did look to see what I could pick one up for, and prices were $650-$999 so they are scarce and desirable. But not used at that price.
6 Likes
Your impressions all line up well with my own on those amps. I’m starting to feel like the Liquid Platinum hype is starting to die down a bit and I’m hearing more criticisms come out like it feeling more solid state and not much tubiness, as well as sometimes being a bit laid back and not particularly dynamic. Originally, I had planned on buying it to match with Verite, but I have been hearing that it might not be the best match for that given its more laid back nature.
So with that, what are your personal favorite Verite amps? As much as I appreciate the Phonitor XE loaner, I don’t think I find it particularly engaging with Verite. For some reason I tend to even prefer using the EC ZDT Jr with Verite over the Phonitor. I have a feeling the only solid state that could be a really good match would be the ECP Ravenswood 3F, but I don’t know if I’m ready to drop that kind of cash on one. I’ve heard the Glenn OTL amps are excellent pairings, but not a ton of people have heard those and the wait time on that is crazy. How is the Lyr 3 with Verite? I really want to emphasize that visceral, dynamic, and lively nature of Verite so it seems like Lyr 3 could be good. Any good Bottlehead pairings? Woo amps? Eddie Current? DNA?
2 Likes
The Vérité do pair very nicely with the EC ZDT Jr. In fact in the office, where I have one of those and the THX AAA 789, they pretty much spend all their time plugged into the tube amp. They’re also great out of the Bottlehead Crack (more so with the Speedball).
I don’t, personally, find any lack of engagement out of my Phonitor X, but maybe the difference there is in the source being used (I don’t know if you’re using the same source in all cases), or the variant of Vérité, or just personal taste, as I find the Phonitor X pretty much just lets the source and headphones do their thing without editorializing (as long as you leave all the other dials alone).
At the same time, straight out of my DAVE into the Vérité sounds fantastic, and is a very immersive experience, too, same with the Hugo TT 2.
I haven’t tried them with any other EC amps, nor the DNA stuff. And the Lyr 3 had long since gone back to Schiit before my Vérité arrived.
My favorite way to listen to them is via my Woo WA234 MK2 MONO though. I haven’t tried them with any other Woo amps (since I only have this one).
Even out of my DAPs (A&K SP1000M/Cayin N8), they’re wonderful. Sitting down with either one of those and the Vérité, on the deck, with a glass of wine, has a had a fairly consistent result of my getting, shall we say, “too much sun”. Though I will say of those two, I do like the N8’s tube mode with the Vérité over it’s solid-state (that’s true of the N8 in general though, and not a Vérité specific observation).
2 Likes
I prefer them out of my BHC + Speedball and I am using the 6sn7 adapter tubes… just really hard to go away from that setup. The Cayin HA-1A does a good job but it is closer to neutral than the BHC (but I still need to do some more tube rollin with that one).
If I had a preference it would be BHC+SB -> Cayin HA-1A ->EC ZDT JR (this might usurp the Cayin…I just ordered someNOS Lightning bolt WE tubes for it…and it is still burnin in the og Ruskie tubes).
The BHC+SB and the Verite and Aeolus are like magic… very musical, enveloping and engaging… I actually want to buy some more and start making them…I really want to get the S.E.X. and Mainline down the road also.
1 Like
I’ve been looking online and admiring the Cayin N8. It really is a special thing.
2 Likes
Sounds even better than it looks too …
Though I am still torn between the brass-black and stainless versions aesthetically.
I tend to “buy black” when it’s an option, as it seems to have about triple the demand when it comes time to sell it. And it’s a gorgeous unit in black, but still the stainless is really pretty.
1 Like
Yes the Brass-Black is a really stunning look. It just oozes quality. Even when viewed online.
2 Likes
In person with the tube glow it is a stunner for sure!
2 Likes
Thanks for those impressions. You know I have been meaning to pickup a BH Crack + Speedball kit for a while now as I really do want to build one. That could be a good starting place. Could you and/or @TylersEclectic speak to how Crack+Speedball differs from EC ZDT Jr? My main DAC is the RME, which I know both of you guys also use.
1 Like
The BHC + SB is fuller, wider, more impactful, and honestly more enjoyable. I have a hard time not turning up the volume too much when listening to the BHC.
The EC ZDT Jr is almost right there though…feels cleaner, slightly less impactful…not as overwhelming. Treble isn’t as “potent”…
Now mind you tubes are not stock on the BHC+SB, and the EC is stock (new tubes on the way). But they are close…but call it bias but I prefer overall the BHC+SB (bias because I built it and it is unique to me ). Plus tube rolling is much more viable with the BHC.
4 Likes
I’m curious, out of your Hugo TT 2 are you driving the Verite via the lower unbalanced TRS output (288 mW RMS 300Ω) or the higher balanced XLR output that you need an adapter for on the back (1.15 W RMS 300Ω)?
I’ve done both.
There’s more than enough power and headroom there to make them sing from the front-panel, as well as play raucously loud (i.e. louder than I could stand for real-world listening) without issues.
The same is true with my DAVE which has 154mW available from it’s direct output at 300Ω.
1 Like
Thanks.
In my ongoing to quest to complete my Phonitor/Verite setup I am still undecided on what DAC to upgrade to from my Modi Multibit (V1). I was thinking of the Yggdrasil Gen A2 or just getting a Hugo TT 2 as an AIO to replace the Phonitor but I was concerned that the Hugo (out of the front panel) would not be sufficient to properly drive the Verite. Having a separate DAC is always more flexible but the compact and tidy nature of an AIO like the Hugo TT 2 is also very attractive.
If you don’t mind, what would be your thoughts on this, considering as you said that the from your experience the TRS output of the Hugo is plenty sufficeint?
1 Like