Such measurements are done with test signals VASTLY simpler than real music, with instruments that present a RIDICULOUSLY more consistent response than any known transducer.
Also …
You can’t hear distortion below -90 dB in any normal environment. Hell, if you’re quoting SINAD, then the likely origin of those numbers showed he couldn’t hear noise/distortion below about -35 dB!
And “the source of the music” is nonsense unless you’re using the same chain as the artist. And you’re not.
Get something you like the SOUND of.
Music is for enjoyment … not some puritanical notion of “perfection”.
Poor wording on my part, best in technical performance maybe? I enjoy my prestaged Monoprice LP from time to time, but it just sounds louder, more shrill to me. I had the Mjolnir 2 as well and did not enjoy it very much for long periods.
I just mean they are very low distortion headphone amps, great channel balance, very clean low distortion to power.
I am sure there are great amps out there that don’t measure well but sound good. I personally have not found one that I liked currently. It’s just a part of me cannot bring myself to pay 2K for an amp that measures poorly, but that’s just me and what I have preferred so far.
Its also how much distortion is introduced depending on the volume and power its outputting.
So 3rd gain at 12 o’clock on one amp might start clipping and sounding terrible vs a another that will sound as clean has it did on 1st gain at 12 o’clock.
The RME-ADI DAC FS is a perfect example of a clean AMP and DAC to me. It’s what I typically recommend if you are not needing crazy power given all the features you get. If you do need power then you can just stack a good AMP with it. However something like the L30 and the its counterpart DAC for 250ish, is wonderful bang for your buck.
I will admit my Matrix DAC is one of the best sounding DAC’s I have heard, but IDK if thats my bias, sound is a funny thing, the brain can play tricks on you.
Unless your L30 was built in the future, I wouldn’t put it anywhere near any headphone I own. If you don’t know why, Google is your friend (or even the first post in the L30 thread here).
I had heard about that, given its topping with a fairly good track record, I choked it up to a bad run or unit.
Things happen, hey at the end of the day if you are running $1500+ headphones odds are you are not using an L30 or a liquid Spark.
But Toppings been pretty solid I think the a50s and a90 are great amps, I liked my little l30, retuned it for the a50s however, which I am starting to not like for reasons outside of its sound, its the small volume knob.
Best in technical performance / or measurement? I think that’s far maybe. Not best in what people enjoy, the audio world is subjective and based on personal perfrance.
I think that’s why people cringe when asked what’s better X or Y, you kind of need to get more in depth with the question because its more complicated than a simple answer.
There is a lot of equipment on the market with a lot of marketing around said product. I use the measurements as a filter personally. It a debate as old as time in audio, R2R and Multibyte vs Delta Sigma chips, headphone cables at 300 bucks for the 80 dollar headphone cable, like do you enjoy it? OK great!
Anyways, do you think 6w into 32ohm’s is good enough to fully drive the Susvara?
Right it sounds like a few people had some bad units with failures, I am sure they sold a lot of units and only a few had an issue, but instead of topping just saying that was one bad unit they handled it the right way by saying they are revamping the design.
I agree and totally understand, its not worth it for a 130 dollar amp, tons of other options on the market.
This topic has been beaten to death in almost every headphone and amp thread. Please continue to browse the internet and take a look at the other Susvara threads in other forums and see if they’re recommending the amps that you listed. This article to me was pretty interesting.
Distortion has a negative connotation to it but there’s reason to believe that 2nd and 3rd order harmonics actually contribute to things like sound stage or a pleasing sound signature. It is still impossible to look at a graph and tell someone how that component will sound. This is also why synergy is a big thing.
Anyways, hopefully on your journey discovering if the Susvara is for you, you learn to appreciate the affect a good amplifier has on your transducer. People pair components that are 2-3x the cost of the Susvara rather than use an A90. It would be naïve to think that all those people just have way too much money to spend and want to buy the best when they can buy the “most transparent amps on the market” for a fraction of the cost.
Sure, I get what your saying to be fair some of it is business, a small company needs to invest more money into R&D and might pay more to manufacture their product, that factors into price.
Thank you for the link, that is helpful. Maybe its my ignorance but to me its electricity. If you were to crack open a 3K headphone amp, what exactly are they doing in there that makes it sound better but not measure as good. That is honestly the part I struggle with, what component or way of implementation is different?
Is it because they have learned to play with the harmonic distortion in a way that makes it sound better maybe, there has to be something I am missing here.
I am sorry, I didn’t mean to open a can of worms, I do apologize if I upset anyone and appreciate your help.These are honest question, not trying to be rude, forgive my lack of wording, I struggle as you can tell from dyslexia.
It depends on the quality of those 6 watts as well as appropriate current delivery and impedance matching, among other things.
What pleases one set of ears may not please another. What thrives in one system may not thrive in another.
Measurements can help as a filter, in theory. I used to consider measurements and chase the notion of transparency/reference. It ended up not agreeing with my ears. May you attain that which you are seeking.
No worries. It’s fine to not understand. There’s been a group that tends to believe that measurements are the end all be all and if it doesn’t measure well, that must means it sounds bad even though subjectively, it can sound great.
There’s definitely a lot more going on in the more expensive amps. What experienced engineers tell us time and time again is that every single thing changes the sound. Whether it be a capacitor, an opamp, or the volume knob, everything has a sound to it.
Surely, you don’t live your life based on what measures the best? Say you enjoy sweets a lot. Does that mean that the food with the most sugar content is the best? Of course not. There needs to be a mix of other ingredients for something to taste good. Same with any other experiences in your life. Do you purchase a car based just on it’s 0-60 speed? That’s just one aspect of the car. If you don’t live your life like that, why are you only viewing amps like that? Especially when music is so complex and measurements are just measuring one note or one aspect of the amp. That seems a bit intellectually dishonest.
I’m not saying that measurements shouldn’t exist. I think we still haven’t fully found the correlations between objective measurements and subjective experiences yet.
@Inkey31 , you shouldn’t need to feel that you have to apologize for liking Topping (some of our Core Team members have and like A90s, others have owned Topping amps along their journey) or for asking questions. Everyone has their own taste regarding what sounds good to them. I think the statement that Topping was the best touched a few nerves, but you weren’t trying to provoke anyone with that statement.
@driftingbunnies has provided some really helpful information. And if you haven’t already done it, I’d recommend reading this whole thread from the top, as many Susvara owners have talked about the amps they’ve tried, including the A90 I think.
It sounds like you have some cognitive dissonance occurring. Measurements are good, amp sounds bad. Measurements poor, amp sounds good. How do you square that circle? What does a measurement actually mean? At what point does it become a mastabatory number chasing game? Is it possible that measurements really don’t mean much, at least past a certain performance level?
Lot of good ears in this forum, very few of us talk about amp measurements outside of power specs and impedance.
