IEMs Discovery & General Discussion

[Tom_Ato]

That’s what I mean. I am using different cables on all IEMs (not only EE) where the stock cable is painful to use.

I ordered 5 different cables from Satin Audio to test from the cheapest 79$ to the second most expensive one at 415$.

They ALL are very soft and a pleasure to use and build quality is excellent. And they all come with a leather cable clip!!!

I have a small comparison in case someone is interested.

I know I’m stressing this topic a bit - sorry about that - but the more gear I have/had, the more usability becomes important beside sound.

[prfallon69]

I agree Tom. Without comfort you’re going to have a hard time relaxing and hence enjoying the experience to the full. Lets face it, when were paying these amounts of cash out its about the experience as a whole not just the quality of the sound.

Always up for your thoughts on anything iem related.

[Gordon_Freeman]

Cables are an important part of an IEM, so keep it up!
And I second your remarks re Satin; it is one of my 2 normal go-to cable pushers due to fair prices and great quality and design.

[NickZ]

The cables look great. A couple questions that the pics don’t show -

1. Is there strain relief on the connectors?

2. Do the IEM connectors add much extra weight?

Thanks

[Tom_Ato]

Here some pictures for you. It’s actually 2 different cables from SA. You can probably see the strain relief on the pins which is hardly visible in use. For the plug, it has an internal strain relief also made of transparent shrink tube, but I did not succeed taking a decent picture as I only have my phone right now.

I would say the quality is excellent throughout.
And yes, they have some of the best price/value ratios on the market. Also, look at their packaging!

Did I mention the cables look like jewelry? They have a very nice sparkle and… Oh, I just shut up now

[NickZ]

Thanks for the pics. I can see the clear tubing for the strain relief.

It looks like they are all over-ear cables so they wouldn’t add much weight to light IEMs.

[Tom_Ato]

Yes, exactly. All over ear.
And no, they do not add much weight. They are very comfortable to wear at least for my ears.

[PaisleyUnderground]

I just checked out the Satin Audio website and their prices are much better than the US companies I’ve bought from. For instance, their Medusa II is a 26awg pure OCC silver cable for $259, which is a bargain (assuming the build quality and sound quality are good). I do like the jewelry look!

I look forward to hearing your thoughts on these. I might get some for my IEMs.

[darmanastartes]

2020 was not a great year for a variety of reasons, one of which was stagnation in the budget end of the IEM market. There were no budget IEM launches this year that had the kind of industry-shaking impact that the Blon BL-03 had in 2019. Instead, a lot of companies fell into ruts, iterating on past designs without much forward movement. In this article, I give my thoughts on the also-rans and faceplants of 2020:
IEM Round-Up: The Worst of 2020. The Meh, The Bad, and the Ugly

[pwjazz]

While they both have absolutely piercing treble, CX4 sounds like a tin can, whereas the CX10 sounds like a tin can with the beans still inside.

Quality writing!

[Banbeucmas]

As a Vietnamese, I kinda know the brand well. You can custom order the strain relief. The cable is quite hard but light.
They are by far not the best cable I have tried but they are decent.

[Tom_Ato]

All right. Here’s some impressions from cable-rolling with Empire Ears Phantom.
Don’t know if it’s helpful but here goes…

Impressions of Satin Audio cables
Satin Audio | Audio Cables Handcrafted in Vietnam

When comparing the virtues of replacement/alternative cables, one must always keep in mind that different factors (like cable dimensions, materials, etc.) impact the way that cables “transport” the information (music) from source to head-/earphones. I am no expert in this nor do I have a degree in electrical engineering or physics.

I can only say that, from my experience, different cables influence the sound of different head-/earphones differently. My impressions here were only done with 1 IEM, so the differences really display the differences for this one combination.

Equipment used

• EE Phantom
• stock cable “Alpha-IV” as reference point (2.5mm balanced, around 150,-$)
• various Satin Audio cables (2.5mm balanced)
• Astell & Kern SP1000M

Introduction

Satin Audio (SA) may not be as well known and established as other cable manufacturers, but they are well on the way of making themselves a name in the industry for an incredible and (at least for me) thus far unheard of price/value proposition.

In my search for reasonable cable replacements I one day stumbled over their website and the aestethics and priced of their products instantly made me curious. I made contact with their customer service and, a few days later, had a nice chat with the founder and head of SA, Minh Nguyen and one of his co-workers Sophie. We talked about their products and how Minh got the idea to produce headphone cables.

Basically he told me that, in Vietnam, audio upgrade accessories are very common but often too expensive for vietnamese people to afford. He was in that same position some years back. So he decided to make his own cables. Minh’s cables were well received and he was finally able to make a business out of it. Fast forward a couple of years and Minhs business has spawned several product lines and most of their cables have been refined into a second generation.

Minh told me that they experimented with lots of materials and material-combinations for the cables themselves and the insulation. They even design/make their own connectors and splits! Their goals were the best possible quality at the lowest possible price. To my surprise, they not only looked at sound quality but also at usability of their cables. When you hold one of their cables in your hands, you will instantly know what I mean: The sleeve materials are so transparent, that you can see the sparkling metals underneath and they feel very soft to the touch. The strands and immaculate braiding make for very flexible and tangle-free cables with low microphony.

You have certainly noticed by reading those lines that I am a fan of Minh and his emlpoyees of Satin Audio. I can only have the highest respects for such passion and devotion to something you love doing and succeeding to make a business out of it.

But let’s get down to business now.

Sound impressions (compared to Ares-IV stock cable)

1) SA Hyperion 8x (100.50$ for 8x, 70.50$ for 4x)

• Enhanced, fuller bass
• more sonorous overall sound signature
• slightly sharp treble at times

2) SA Chimera II 4x (129$)

• Voices appear a lot more present and forward
• enhanced treble
• bass has good presence and impact while remaining laid back and controlled
• more spacious (great for Phantom)

3. SA Kraken II 4x (189$)

• Similar sound signature to Chimera II
• enhanced treble on EE Phantom (at times a bit too much)

4. SA Medusa II 4x (259$)

• Voices appear more present and forward but without being harsh
• bass tight and more controlled
• treble enhanced without being harsh (great for Phantom)

5. SA Athena 4x (415$)

• Voices appear more present and forward and silky smooth
• Extended bass and sub-bass with good control
• Sonorous, present mids
• enhanced silky treble
• enhanced details and resolution
• overall more relaxed sound signature (great for Phantom)

The connectors on my Athena are the new high-end brass connectors that SA only used on their totl Zeus until now. So from now on, those are standard for Athena too. The cable sleeve was my personal wish as I wanted something more toned down.

Remarks

• All cables can be highly customized from 4, 6 to 8 braids, different lenghts, different options for connectors and by special request, cable sleeves.
• The build quality of all cables, from cheapest to most expensive is on the same very high level.
• The connectors on the cables that I tested look different than on their website as I received the cables with the latest updates.

Pictures of packaging
(Those are pictures from Satin Audio as I don’t have the boxes with me)

[Tom_Ato]

Empire Ears HERO pictures & comparisons

As promised, the rest of my HERO review. It seems that I can’t just edit my previous post:

Comparisons

Shozy & AAW Pola39 (950,-US$)

The Pola39 at 950$ is somewhat in the price range of the HERO. It features a proprietary 10 mm dynamic driver plus DUAL electrostatic drivers. It features a crazy 10Hz-100kHz frequency range due to the electrostatic drivers. It needs significantly more power than the HERO hence is a bit harder to drive.

The treble is not what you would expect here given the specs but rather soft and silky vs. the much more forward treble on the HERO. Detail retrieval is good on the Pola39 but better still with the HERO. Voices are more pronounced on the HERO too. Both IEMs have a nice bass- and sub-bass impact but HERO just punches a bit harder and goes a bit deeper. I would describe the sound of the Pola39 as more relaxed and laid back vs. the more engaging presentation on the HERO.

The Pola39 is a fair bit smaller than the HERO and also has a more shallow insertion depth making it more suitable for small ears. For my medium sized ears, the Pola39 just disappears after a while making it more comfortable to wear.

Both IEMs certainly have their merits and as often, it comes down to preference or maybe the mood you’re in while listening.

Empire Ears Legend X (2199,-US$)

Switching to the Legend X (LX), there are quite some similarities within the family.
The bass and sub-bass reproduction are not that far apart with a slight edge maybe for the LX in terms of impact and tonality. Overall, there’s more bass “foundation” noticeable on the LX, defining the whole sound signature while the bass on HERO is a bit more contained and separated from the rest of the spectrum.

The perceived stage on LX is larger, actually pretty much everything on LX seems larger due to that voluptuous bass elevating everything. Treble on the LX is smoother with pretty much the same detail retrieval than on HERO. There is no sibilance noticeable on LX.

It’s really hard to describe the differences as the basic sound signature is quite similar but also different. The overall experience, at least for me, is superior on the LX. It feels more refined, coherent and effortless which is no surprise given the +850$ surcharge on the LX.

Empire Ears Odin (3399,-US$)

Going to the Odin, this one is just a very different beast from everything else I know.
The adjectives coming to mind are satisfying, effortless, natural. The last bit of artificial tonality is gone, this is pure bliss, really. Yet the inheritance is undeniable.

You get a similar tonality and overall sound signature with HERO. I think it could very well be Thor, the son of Odin. While Thor (HERO) is brimming with energy and enthusiasm and once in a while does something stupid, Odin is just that more well controlled, wise and well matured - it’s perfection. I can almost taste the guitar strings in Alice in Chains “Rooster” on their MTV Unplugged album and it instantly makes me smile.

Again: at 2050$ more, that should be no surprise. Both IEMs are great in their own right and market segments.

Pictures

[Precogvision]

Hey all, here are just some quick impressions of the Galaxy Buds Pro. I won’t focus too much on the technical stuff and will mainly be addressing the actual sound. I was surprised by how small the case is! It’s a little thicker than the AirPods Pro case, but feels more compact. The controls of the Buds Pro do seem somewhat finicky; for example, I don’t like how they inadvertently pause or swap through the ANC modes each time you physically adjust them. You also lose access to a lot of flexibility on iOS (as there’s no app).

@taronlissimore hooked me up, and boy, am I glad I got the chance to hear these anyways. I listened to them the whole evening the day they arrived and almost fell asleep with them on! I’ve been listening to them on-and-off the last couple days, but my positive initial impressions haven’t changed much.

They’re warmer, more V-shaped than their predecessors; the bass shelf doesn’t level out until slightly past 600hZ. The quality of the bass is good overall; however, bloat does seem imminent at times which I’d attribute to a lack of intangible control. While the upper-midrange presentation doesn’t seem to have changed much, this more gentle slope to the bass region makes the Buds Plus a tad less lean - a criticism of most Harman-oriented IEMs - in the notes. Another welcome change is the treble. Treble is almost perfectly linear throughout the impact and crash regions. Yeah, it’s still fairly elevated, and while I don’t think extension is much better, this is impressive considering how rare normal treble is in most cheaper IEMs.

Technical ability is, of course, more middling and I don’t think it’s really an improvement over the OG Buds or Buds+ in this regard. In fact, I suspect some might find the OG Buds and Buds+ slightly more resolving because they’re brighter, leaner in the notes. I’d also be remiss if I did not point out a notable lack of center image incisiveness; even for a TWS, the Buds Pro are pushing it on this front. Nonetheless, the Buds Pro have an extremely pleasing tonal balance. Good enough, in fact, for me to say that not only is this the best TWS I’ve heard yet, but that the Buds Pro are also competitive with many of their similarly-priced, wired counterparts.

TL;DR Definitely some technical limitations - particularly if you’re on iOS - but the sound itself is quite good, even class-leading for TWS.

[prfallon69]

Nice impressions @Precogvision. I have the OG Buds and really like them for what they do. Especially as I got them at a great price.

[rho]

I’ve been playing around with different types of eartips these last weeks and now I’m kind of confused.
There are some tips that I really like. But I get different results from day to day. Is this normal?
Ex. When using the stock L eartips on my Tin T2 plus, it usually sounds really good. But sometimes it’s just too much bass and the mids sound a bit too much on the background. Usually the SpinFit CP100 XL sounds a bit leaner. It does that too when the stock L tips sound too bass heavy, which means they sound great and not too lean. They have cleaner highs on those days too.
So the soundsignature can change from day to day, with the same tips. Most noticeably on the bass but certainly not limited to the bass.
Since I keep notes for all the tips I tried, I can now make a good guess which ones will sound best for the day. (if my initia choice in tip doesn’t sound the best)
Is this quite common or not?

[generic]

It’s true for me. This sometimes follows from a case/chassis that’s loose in my ears. They move in and out randomly with silicone tips, and I find that foam tips provide a more predictable fit. Some IEMs have vent holes that face the head too (my Moondrop Kanas Pro), whereby they’ll become boomy when the holes are covered.

IEM fit is always finicky. This is why I avoid them, this is why the ear-shape-molded Custom IEM (CIEM) industry was created, and why it continues.

[rho]

I hav the same issue with foam tips. I tried Comply tips and InAirs. Both sound a bit different from day to day.
But I can get good sound when I make the right selection. It takes just a few tries.
It actually keeps it a bit interesting for now. So it’s not frustrating me yet.

I was looking at CIEM but since we are in lockdown I don’t think I can get a scan or physical model made from my ear-canal now.
For my budget Thieaudio looks like an interesting option if I would go custom.

[NickZ]

Our bodies change from day to day.

We often don’t do anything near the limits so we never notice. If you do yoga or lift weights you notice how things that were easy yesterday can be hard today.

It wouldn’t surprise me if the normal small changes in our bodies would also effect iem fit.

[rho]

I compete in powerlifting. I’ve hardly ever noticed such big changes in performance from day to day. (except when overreaching for too long) But that’s a completely different topic. (extensive/nuanced/… not for this forum )

My ears tend to change more from day to dat than my muscles.
It’s Comply T500 L for today. Enjoying some Zappa (Zoot Allures) right now.