That’s interesting, as most of the time I can’t tell any difference apart from more power being available. So I do wonder if the additional power is a factor in balanced outputs sounding subjectively better with some devices (e.g. DAPs, where the added power could in fact make a difference in driving the headphones correctly or not with headphones such as the HD600/650). With earphones, that are 99% of the time adequately powered with any DAP or portable amplifier, I can’t hear any difference between balanced and single-ended. So I do wonder what could be the difference at play here? What explanation do you give to the difference in sound? (serious question!)
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Balanced seems to greatly reduce background noise with dynamic driver headphones. More power does improve most headphones, but what I’m talking about is not power related.
My take is that dynamic drivers involve moving a large mass rapidly back and forth with a magnet. The cone/driver has a natural resonance, whereby any background noise activates the cone’s natural vibrations. Dynamic drivers can be made from paper, plastic, bio-cellulose, metal, or other things. Following back-to-back testing, my HD-600s CLEARLY sound like buzzy plastic while my Elex drivers CLEARLY sound like tinkling/ringing metal.
Before using a balanced setup the HD-600s had substantial hiss – this turned into a kind of boxy or hollow smoothness on balanced. Before balanced the Elex had an intense dynamic glare, whereby some mid to high end notes were way to loud and piercing. After balanced this characteristic nearly disappeared (nearly). Balanced improved both.
Now, I fully agree with you that a balanced amp can improve power-hungry headphones simply by delivering more power. That’s my interpretation with most planar headphones: nice, but not very important.
With IEMs I agree. Balanced often adds little or no value.
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I spent a few days comparing the Monprice 887 to Schitts older Magni 3. I had to revert back to the SE cable to do the comparison because the Magni 3 of course only has the one SE 1/4" output jack…
I did the comparison but the sound with the Focal Clears on the 887 was so so to me and when I returned to the balanced cable things just popped back into focus, such a quiet black background…it still amazes me there is this much of a “discernable” difference!
Thinking strongly of upgrading from my Bifrost 1 to Bifrost 2 just for the total balanced flow.
Alex
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The original Magni 3 is a pretty distorting amp – worse than many other single ended amps. I honestly preferred simple PC and phone output for tone and clarity. I hated the Magni 3 so much that I sent it back at my expense and paid the restocking fee.
If it were almost anyone other than you (and a few others we can both count on one hand), I’d be looking for the source of the hiss somewhere. A source of heat, that Sony Walkman Cassette source, EMI, or some disturbance in THE FORCE.
Ssssssssnake Serum. This scared me awake all night when I saw it as a child.
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Wow…I never have had any issues with the Magni 3 distorting? After several weeks of testing with a wide variety of headphones from 35 to 600 ohms. What did you replace it with?
Alex
This is a polarizing topic. Some have speculated it results from spotty QC and individual samples may vary. All I know is that I literally preferred phone/tablet/PC output over the Magni 3. The Magni 3 made song dynamics go completely flat – loud passages dulled out and never had any impact.
During that era I had a (Mass)Drop CTH, a FiiO Alpen 2 (E17K), and Bravo Audio V2. These days I’m using a (Mass)Drop THX AAA 789, a FiiO Q5, and a Loxjie P20 with a tube swap.
My first Magni 3 I sent back (B-stock) for a noisy vol pot. It worked very well for a few months before the pot became noisy, no low volume channel imbalance…they sent me a new one in a few days, excellent customer service to me…this one has worked very well for a month now…and I have compared it to the 887 I have and when level matched its amazing how well they both sound…believe it or not to me they are really close in sound presentation, the 887 is quieter to me and I prefer it to the Magni3. but either one is really pretty good here. More than enough impact in loud passages…
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Ok I have had my “reference” Monoprice 887 for several weeks and have gont thru many AB sessions with 10+ other amps. The last one I am doing is using high impedance cans on this amp vs my Schitt Vahalla 2 OTL amp. Recently on some other sites there was a discussion on this paring and comparisone between the two…so here are my 2 cents.
I have had the Vahalla 2 for since they came out, it was sent back once for a AC hum that developed after a few months use, transfomer power lamination seemed to be the issue, sent back to Schitt and they replaced the entire main pcb (includes the xfmr)…excellent service. Paid for shipping back and forth to me!
Over time the two best pairing with the HD600’s I have were with this amp and the BH Crack with CCS mod. Absolutley wonderful for me.
There is a real discernable difference between the two amps, IMO easily discerbnable.
So whats the difference and how do I like or feel about these two very, very different amps?
Well both drive the HD600s to extremely loud listening levels easily…I use the High gain setting on the Vahalla2 and Gain 2 on the Monoprice THX AAA 887. The HD600s nominal impedance is 300 ohms, but this swings with the varying frequencies.
The 887 is rated at approx 185 mw at 300 ohms, while the Vahalls2 is rated at approx 300 mw at 300ohms and 340mw at 600 ohms. This is a SE power statement. (no balance cable for the HD600’s and the V2 only has a SE output jack).
One reason I bought the Vahalla 2 was to have an amp with more power than my other good BH Crack OTL amp, to see how they compared…another story.
After the usual level setting, I use a homemade headphone adapter I can attach to a headphone earpad and use my Radio Shack SPL meter to set the levels to 75dB with a 1Khz test tone…
So it didnt take long for me to hear a difference…The tube Schitt Vahalla tube OTL amp gives a nice smooth sounding, abit warm with the HD600s…a really nice sound, but compared to the 887 its not as clear sounding…
With the 887 the sound is just so clear, open, transparent…crisp…so the high end on the HD600’s allowed to be heard as I think they were designed…not so with the Vahalla 2.
The soundstage I am experiencing is about the same, equal depth.
The difference in these two opposites allow me to use those well used adjectives, like warm, sterile, lean, congested etc…the 887 is indeed lean or sterile but clean, crisp and “accurate” as to what is coming thru as the source material. Where as the V2 adds a little more “coloration” and warmth to the overll presentation…things still sound nice overall but there is that “euphonic” tube sound for sure.
So is one better than another? Well thats your decision. IMO I like both but prefer the 887 over the V2 and thats hard for me to admit…I look forward to the source being as accurate as it was recorded good or bad. But thats me.
I will bring out the BH Crack and do the same type of comparsion.
I could have listed many songs an individual examples of the differences, but in the end its a classic solid state (a very good measuring one) vs vacuum tubes comparison…
Good Morning!
Alex
Note: I am posting this in this thread just because I am comparing this amp with another amp of totally different topology…I could have put this in a seperate thread or in the Schitt area. So if you want please place this over to one of these if you think this isnt the best place for this comparison.
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Funny thing, and Torq has mentioned this as well…just listening to one or the other after a few minutes they both sound just great!!! Funny thing how our brains perceive audio!!
Alex
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Great comparison writeup. I enjoyed reading this.
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Ha!
Thanks for the nice words!! Such a refreshing attitude here on this headphone forum!!
Sometimes I feel like I am bloviating too much!! But I like sharing my experiences with you all!
Alex
:>)
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Heheh … you said “Bloviating”…heh heh heh…
seriously though, as long as people are civil and open to others thoughts and experiences the internet is a great place to visit!
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The internet is a psychopath.
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Nice write up Alex!
I think most of us here appreciate you sharing these findings.
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The more I use this amp, the more I am impressed with its just not being there…
Yes my tube amps are great but the absolute quietness with good cans allows for great low level listening and normal levels…its an inky black quiet!! :>)
With no noise or hiss or humm the music just pops out at you good or bad…still leaning on a dac updrade in the next few months but really dont think it will matter much for me.
I have gotten used to how the volume control allows for precise level setting, I used to think the small pot inside with the big knob might be problematic but over time its really an easy thing to adjust. I dont use replay gain stuff so dependent on the recording I am always adjusting the volume to suit my listening level preference. I would call this volume control setup a buttery smooth, thats soft butter !!! :>)
One of the best $400 I have spent in this crazy hobby!
Alex
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Unless your current DAC does not have balanced output and you want to take advantage of that feature, my advice is to save your money to buy more music. Your DAC will work just fine.
Having a Drop AAA 789 I can totally relate to your findings and sensations. This is probably the ultimate amplifying technology. I can’t honestly think of anything better.
I too have tube amplifiers, but I think they serve a different purpose: they’re better for laid-back listening when I don’t actually care too much about the fidelity and I just want to listen to something that I like. I think tubes are complementary to an accurate solid-state amp, not alternative. It’s great to have options!
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Thanks for the advice, been doing this stuff for so long it should be self evident to me!! :>)
The Bifrost 1 with the Unison USB that I have, does not have balanced inputs…the B2 does and this is one reason that I am looking to do this upgrade…and for the newer dac chips…
That said I dont think sonically it will add that much of a difference at all…but hey you cant take it with you!!
Alex
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Well… I have had the 789…and the monoprice AIO version…and I no longer have either…their are some clear paths upward from both of these amps… but it is a thing of diminishing returns for sure. What replaced them for me was the SPL Phonitor XE (I wanted the headphone version for comparison reasons) and “to me” it is in the same vein as the THX amps just the next couple levels up. Power out the woo-ha and inky black background. Plus…it looks dope 
That being said I am interested in the new THX amp only option from Monoprice… but I have no real need for it, unless I went back to office space work… and even then I like the portability of my Cayin N6ii DAP…
Honestly, what Drop, and Monoprice have done here with the THX amps is awesome and I can’t wait for the “big” boys in the industry to take notice and bring down the prices of the premium gear…go for quality and more sales to offset the loss of profit of large ticket items.
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