I can’t say from experience, but lots of reviews indicate that the Jot 2 is an improvement over the Jot 1, but if the Jot 1 is still serving you well, I wouldn’t think that a Jot 2 would be enough of a step up to justify the price. IMHO, I would try a different amp altogether or adding a tube preamp if you don’t have one. You’ll get more of a difference with your money that way than going from a Jot 1 → Jot 2 probably.
Take all of this with a grain of salt obviously… 
Jot question day.
My jot arrives tomorrow. I bought the 4490 model because I don’t have an external dac currently and it shipped in 1-3 days.
I read this entire thread including the comments on 4490 vs multibit card vs bifrost.
My ultimate plan is to get a bifrost or some r2r dac for the jot or whatever amp I end up keeping.
What I want to know is what kind of difference do people hear with the bifrost vs the 4490 card?
I want to set my expectations correctly for this amp. My m11 plus was pretty disappointing on a number of levels. And part of that was expectation vs reality.
Essentially, I don’t want to miss out on a good amp if it is just the 4490 getting in the way.
The Jot 2 will likely perform best with a stand alone DAC, as opposed to a delta sigma DAC module. I’ve owned the Jot 2 and Bifrost 2 and heard the Jot 2 with Multibit DAC module multiple times at the Schiitr.
What struck me the most was that Schiit DAC modules sound more congested, compressed, with less openness compared to when using a stand alone DAC.
Schiit Multibit DACs have more texture and dimension, imaging and separation, more articulated decay, among other things compared to Schiit AKM. The additional overall detail of Multibit allowed me to listen at lower volumes compared to Schiit AKM.
You can check out Passion 4 Sound, Goldensound, and Currawong’s Bifrost 2 and Modius/Modi 3+ video reviews to approximate sonic comparisons.
I have watched all of them. What I am thinking is it was probably a mistake to get the jot without a synergistic external dac for evaluation.
I just rejected the m11 plus (4497 + thx) because I didn’t care for the sound. Most akm chips I have heard were coupled with thx or toppings linear whatever. And I haven’t liked them much. And I have no idea if it’s the chip, the amp, or the combination.
I’ve paired my AKM 4490 with many amps, and compared it versus Bifrost 2, Burr-Brown, and ESS Sabre. It can take my ears several days to habituate to a stable perception with each.
The AKM is second behind the ESS in treble emphasis, and both perceptually shift room noise/air toward piercing whines and hissy artifacts. I think it’s a function of the algorithms used by Delta Sigma DACs.
The Burr Brown in an iFi ZenDAC is a cheap way to get a hint of the Bifrost’s delivery, as it combines some Delta Sigma’s characteristics with more full-bodied and atmospheric aspects. I can live with the ZenDAC under more circumstances than the AKM 4490 (and I try to avoid the ESS entirely).
Comparing DACs back-to-back lets you hear a lot of differences. DACs can have as much of an impact as the amp (at least SS amps), for they set the maximum potential of the amp.
This is a good idea. I could get one of these here quickly to try with the jot. The zen stack was one thing I was considering.
If your goal is optimized sonics, the mistake may have been getting the built in DAC module. However, it’s a cost effective and tidy one-box option.
With these brands, you not liking them is likely not due to the chip. With these brands, I’d attribute it more to their house sound. While chips do possess certain characteristics as @generic notes, I’m not in a position to isolate what certain chips sound like. Schiit AKM implementations are likely to sound different from the brands you mentioned.
I subscribe to the principle that it’s the entire system. One individual component can thrive in one system, but not another.
Also consider that with food and eating, we don’t taste through to the separate raw ingredients, but rather taste the chef’s preparation and resulting dish/meal. Perhaps similar principles apply to audio and hearing the manufacturer’s/builder’s implementation and tuning/voicing.
If you’re curious and in it to explore and accumulate, try and hear it all. Otherwise, you, your wallet, and resale/return efforts should be wary of sidegrades.
It’s out for delivery. We shall see.
My goal here is to find something that makes me want to sit in my chair and listen to music at night.
None of the stationary solutions have done that for me. The ifi micro signature got close (and, in fact, it may be the answer now, but wasn’t then).
I ran the Jot with the Bifrost 2 before moving up to the Mjolnir 2 and then eventually move to the Matrix X-Sabre Pro MQA. Before the Bifrost 2, I had the THX 789 which was towards the beginning of this adventure. Honestly, each DAC I’ve owned has had it’s pro’s and con’s but to me, they sounded very similar. It’s interesting listening to the forum lately. Some people really don’t like certain things such as the Topping, I tried that and fought with the USB and that was an immediate turn off for me and returned it, never returning to the Topping. Some people don’t like Schiit amps. I’ve owned two and never any issues. They’re simple, straight forward and budget friendly. Some people don’t like Sabre dac. I’ve only ever tried the Matrix and other than setting the correct voltage and update the firmware. No issues. The wifi on the Element is a little finicky but I think that’s part of my network also. With that said, each has it’s benefits, again. The Bifrost is great, simple, great resale if you don’t like it. Con’s, it’s simple, power is in the back, there’s no bell’s and whistle if you call that a con. Matrix Sabre dac’s, con, three times the price of the Bifrost but it does at least three times what the Bifrost does or more. Does that make it worth it? Up to you. I bring up all the dac information as I think we all take some things on the forum’s as what’s best for us when in all actuality, it’s a personal preference. I also used the Jot for only an amp and not a dac amp, so I couldn’t say that the dac would be worth it but you would think that a separate dac and amp would be better. I own the Element X all in one now and luckily I found an open box for a good price.That Sabre dac is the same in the X-Sabre. My point, it may be a small improvement adding the Bifrost on top of the Jot versus the dac in the Jot. Budget wise, the Jot and dac might be the smartest option. Double that price, separate Bifrost and Jot might get you that small, diminishing return as we all know happens. Again, I think we all take forum as word or law, once you get it and if you have an option to compare, you may or may not think the same way. Don’t underestimate all the other options out there, take many opinions and hear what you can.
The last time I did this I had dx3 pro, sp200/m200, xduoo ta-30, a90/d90, ifi micro signature with overlap of most of them to a/b. None of them were intriguing enough to keep a stack at one of the two locations where I can sit and listen to music. The micro signature was the closest.
This time, I will have nothing to compare it to in house that isn’t the qudelix. (I was going to order the zen dac/zen can, but decided against it). I picked the jot because it is routinely called a fun amp. And if that sense of fun comes across for me, even with the 4490 dac, then it may be fine. One of the main benefits of ordering this, is I don’t need the “good” dac now, like I would for a burson or most other options. If it turns out I do need the “good” dac now, to make the jot shine for me, then I probably want to hear the burson first (which, of course, also needs the external dac now and costs a lot more).
Was trying to do a baby step that would let me move in the direction of a stack.
They don’t all sound the same, but the chipset seems to be a stronger predictor of delivery than the brand. Many brands focus on one chipset, adding further uncertainty about house sound versus chips (e.g., iFi = Burr Brown, Schiit = historically AKM and multibit, etc.)
In my experience cheaper and no-name DACs are more often brighter and have less treble noise filtering. Expensive brands care more about the supporting parts and refining the audio quality (but within the limits of the chipset).
In the end you must try a specific product and decide for yourself.
Curious why not the true multi-bit versus the 4490? wouldn’t the multi-bit get you a little close to the bifrost 2 for 200 and call that a baby step, see how that combination sounds? 600 for the multi-bit jot versus 400 for amp jot and 700 for the bifrost. Again, the bifrost resell is quick, so you don’t loose much.
In my case my detection of brands and dislike of specific DACs is keyed to treble and treble artifacts. I can live with mixed quality if the treble is controlled, but experience rapid fatigue and discomfort with some. If given an EQ and able to roll the treble off, I’d probably not hear the differences between many of them. (But the Bifrost 2 is substantially different.)
Availability. 4490 in silver shipped in 1-3 days and multibit in months to never.
Burr-brown is multibit as well and has been my favorite. I have no issue with trying the bifrost at its price point. But I didn’t want to spend the whole sum now and also wait months to never to get it.
I am a big returner not a big reseller.
Unless you’re talking about long-since-out-of-production parts, they’re not multi-bit in the way you might think. They’re still 100% delta-sigma converters, they just use a segmented architecture where one part of the conversion is handled by a 5-bit modulator (sometimes 6) instead of a 1-bit modulator.
They are in no way doing conversion, even of those 5 or 6 bits, in the same fashion as any true multi-bit DAC (be it an old PCM63, an AD5547 or a discrete R2R or sign/magnitude converter).
It is possible that you prefer AKM and Jot 2 SE out compared to XLR out depending on the sensitivity of your headphones and preferences.
I’m interested in this unit should I have further demands for portability. I used to have an iFi Nano BL, which I enjoyed and gave to a family member.
I will noodle over this.
True. I am standing by for the prospect of Schiit ESS.
This is consistent with my experience.
I’ve always leaned towards warmer headphones and probably why my go to is the zmf eikon. I don’t care for high treble, etc also or I’d end up the same, doing short listening with equipment that causes a lot of fatigue. That said, I’ve done long sessions with the bifrost and the sabre dac from matrix without fatigue but that’s me also. I just got the element x and with the single ends out and eikon, I’ve put hours of listening over the weekend. I honestly thought again about adding a jot only but i wouldn’t think that would be much better than the Built in amp on the element.
Interesting. I am going by the ifi pages saying burr brown is a multi-bit chip. If that’s a marketing stretch, that is good to know.
They still remain my favorite sound so far. I have not dug into the underlying execution of any of this beyond knowing which chips people use for things. As none of that means anything to me until I hear it. Base on the way people talk about bifrost and r2r, I very much want to hear it.
Hart cables are ready for testing!
It’s definitely good. But at the time, I was purchasing for portability over desktop. And, for me, it doesn’t validate as a portable device. Transportable, yes. Portable, no.